I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:24 pm  

but even I think Osborne is an idiot today! Give up your rights, and get some free shares??? lunacy!

but even I think Osborne is an idiot today! Give up your rights, and get some free shares??? lunacy!

Re: I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:33 pm  

The value of shares can go down as well as up

[DaveO]

Re: I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:08 pm  

Note it says "up to £50000" (worth of free shares).

What is the betting that this will be the exception rather then the rule and what is the minimum amount employers can spend to remove these rights? And what about whether or not the workers can say no?

Unless the cost to employers is small those employing many workers such as supermarkets or the banks won't be able to afford it. Small companies won't be able to hand out £50K to numerous employees either. So for this to work in the way Osborne really wants - workers rights to be removed it must be feasible for employers to do this at much less than £50K.

If workers can be compelled to accept this idea then this is no different than a simple removal of workers rights as proposed earlier in the year.

Also what about new employees of a company. Will they have no rights by default? Will they be forces to accept (no doubt very few) shares on joining?

Re: I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:19 pm  

DaveO wrote:

Note it says "up to £50000" (worth of free shares).

What is the betting that this will be the exception rather then the rule and what is the minimum amount employers can spend to remove these rights? And what about whether or not the workers can say no?

Unless the cost to employers is small those employing many workers such as supermarkets or the banks won't be able to afford it. Small companies won't be able to hand out £50K to numerous employees either. So for this to work in the way Osborne really wants - workers rights to be removed it must be feasible for employers to do this at much less than £50K.

If workers can be compelled to accept this idea then this is no different than a simple removal of workers rights as proposed earlier in the year.

Also what about new employees of a company. Will they have no rights by default? Will they be forces to accept (no doubt very few) shares on joining?

A number of questions there that I doubt crossed Gideon's mind when this was being "brain"stormed

[DaveO]

Re: I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:23 pm  

Chris28 wrote:

A number of questions there that I doubt crossed Gideon's mind when this was being "brain"stormed

It is another shoot from the hip idea that doesn't stand up to the slightest bit of scrutiny when you think for less than a minute about the practicalities of it.

Why would anyone give up their employment rights for what amounts to two years of less than the national average wage?

Re: I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:05 pm  

DaveO wrote:

It is another shoot from the hip idea that doesn't stand up to the slightest bit of scrutiny when you think for less than a minute about the practicalities of it.

Why would anyone give up their employment rights for what amounts to two years of less than the national average wage?

Yep. Or do you just join a company, take the £50,000 shares then immediately sell them and leave?

[DaveO]

Re: I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:17 pm  

Him wrote:

Yep. Or do you just join a company, take the £50,000 shares then immediately sell them and leave?

You won't be able to do that. No one is going to employ you, give you £50K with no strings attached.

A little more digging reveals that the minimum amount an employer has to offer is a mere £2K. £2K for your rights!

This is nothing other than a scrapping of workers rights by the back door. Watch Ltd companies sell themselves to a new company and re-hire the entire staff forcing them to accept these terms!

What is more if they fire you they will be able to buy the shares back at a reasonable price (whatever that means) if you had not already sold them.

The scheme would also be compulsory for new employees of a company. So you will have no option to forgo your rights for a mere £2K if you move job or get one after being unemployed.

As I said this is the scrapping of workers rights by the back door.

Re: I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:32 pm  

DaveO wrote:

...

As I said this is the scrapping of workers rights by the back door.

It is , and they seem bent on scrapping workers' rights by any door available. I expect it'll be trapdoors soon.

Re: I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:37 pm  

In his speech in Birmingham, the chancellor made clear he was not planning to change course and said a further £16bn of savings must be found by 2015/16 to meet his target of balancing the budget within five years.



An invoice for tax to Vodaphone, Topshop et al would be a start.

Re: I never thought the day would come : Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:45 pm  

What happens to people who work for privately owned companies, co-operatives or in the public sector? Do they get to keep their rights?