Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:19 pm  

BobbyD wrote:

Taken from another site:

They were interviewing someone from the EA on the news a few days ago and he was saying that several years ago, conditions were brought in by legislation by the last government as to how the EA were able to spend their flood defence money. The three considerations are -

For each pound spent in flood defences, they have to show that it will save £8 worth of property,

The money must first be spent on the places with the largest and poorest population, &

The money must be spent where flood defences will protect the most property.

The chap said that this is the main reason millions had been spent in large towns and cities and hardly anything in small towns, villages and the countryside.

All the blame game some days ago over dredging in Somerset actually ended up revealing that dredging down there had been stopped in John Major's time.

No government since had restarted the practise and all governments since have made cuts. Labour did boost spending after the government's own scientists warned of increasing problems, but as I said, this government has, by and large, maintained capital spending, but cut revenue spending, which covers repairs and maintenance, to the extent that, with inflation taken into account, the overall budget is down around 25%.

It may well have been Labour that brought in that test – it's a Treasury test that is applied to all spending, as I said (for clarification, I'm currently talking to people connected with the EA for a piece).

The amount of rain that's fallen means that, even with dredging, no river could have taken all the rain that's fallen. I was crossing the Sussex Downs a few weeks ago and the rivers were incredibly high, plus a large number of fields that were had been transformed into lakes.

As the PM (IIRC) said only in the last week, not everywhere can be protected and homes must come first. Applying that criteria, it would make sense to protect the places with the highest density of population. Which, of course, is what the Thames Barrier does (built between 1974 and 1982, IIRC).

In the meantime, I noticed the other day that various scientists have condemned successive governments for being utterly short-termist in looking at the issues.

It remains to be seen whether there will be any change in policy.

And obviously questions could also be asked about a variety of matters that may or may not be related, including farming practices and decisions to build on flood plains.

Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:30 pm  

cod'ead wrote:

We don't need any more barrages, just lay that fat 2@ in th line of any flooding

Fattism.

Just because you are sporting a new super lithe physique.

Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:47 pm  

cod'ead wrote:

This was taken from my van, near Bradfield (between Reading & Newbury) on Friday. While many of my customers fall into the "super rich" bracket, many more do not, lots pf Thames' tributaries like the River Pang have overflowed and flooded even council houses, so you don't have to be in the supertax bracket to suffer.

I spent Friday driving round Somerset, including the northern bit of the Levels. Mostly OK with localised heavy flooding.

Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 5:17 pm  

Mintball wrote:

The amount of rain that's fallen means that, even with dredging, no river could have taken all the rain that's fallen.

And that's the main issue, but people look for someone to blame, so when you're stood knee deep in water, in your kitchen I bet the first reaction isn't, "Bugger me, it rained loads" more, "Who's fault is this, because it's certainly not mine. Flood plain? Oh we thought they were joking."
Which then leads to politicians trying to be seen to be doing something in an attempt to not get blamed too much, but they just look opportunistic. Which then leads them to spending pot loads of cash when it's going to happen again days later.
As for preventative maintenance, unfortunately, to know if somewhere needs it requires a bloody big deluge of water.

From last year, the water is usually 10/12/15 feet lower than this, but afterwards there was lots of work done in widening/repairing culverts etc.

Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:37 pm  

BobbyD wrote:

And that's the main issue, but people look for someone to blame, so when you're stood knee deep in water, in your kitchen I bet the first reaction isn't, "Bugger me, it rained loads" more, "Who's fault is this, because it's certainly not mine. Flood plain? Oh we thought they were joking."
Which then leads to politicians trying to be seen to be doing something in an attempt to not get blamed too much, but they just look opportunistic. Which then leads them to spending pot loads of cash when it's going to happen again days later.
As for preventative maintenance, unfortunately, to know if somewhere needs it requires a bloody big deluge of water.

From last year, the water is usually 10/12/15 feet lower than this, but afterwards there was lots of work done in widening/repairing culverts etc.

Anyone who knows me and who recalls the "Dude Where's My Pond" article will know that I am an expert on these kind of things and frankly if I were that person stood where they're standing then I wouldn't be stood where they're standing, especially if they can hear creaking noises.

Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 7:58 pm  

BobbyD wrote:

And that's the main issue, but people look for someone to blame, so when you're stood knee deep in water, in your kitchen I bet the first reaction isn't, "Bugger me, it rained loads" more, "Who's fault is this, because it's certainly not mine. Flood plain? Oh we thought they were joking."

I entirely agree. And of course, the further we are from: 'it woz god wot did it', then blame will be levied in other directions.

On your further point, while I understand the sentiment, I do think that, if government scientists are consistently making a certain point, one would hope that politicians of whatever party would, in government, look at long-term planning.

That, of course, raises the issue of the connection – or lack thereof – with the public. It would be so welcome to see the end of spin (from whichever party) and serious honesty with the electorate.

Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:17 pm  

It does make you wonder if the Dutch had gone about flood prevention and water management in the same cack-handed, penny-pinching way we had, Amsterdam would probably be the new Atlantis

Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:28 pm  

Mintball wrote:

I entirely agree. And of course, the further we are from: 'it woz god wot did it', then blame will be levied in other directions.

On your further point, while I understand the sentiment, I do think that, if government scientists are consistently making a certain point, one would hope that politicians of whatever party would, in government, look at long-term planning.

That, of course, raises the issue of the connection – or lack thereof – with the public. It would be so welcome to see the end of spin (from whichever party) and serious honesty with the electorate.

Unfortunately, a politician's long term planning is 5 years. Or planning something that's bloody wonderful. Right now, Cameron is saying lots of pleasant, compassionate things but what he's really, really hoping for is a drought or a picture of Ed Milliband with wellies that aren't high enough to stop the water getting in. They're always running for election.

What's the phrase from the film? "You can't handle the truth!" Not so much honesty as I don't believe MP's are dishonest as such, more a certain level of bluntness. The trouble is it mustn't win votes or they'd do it.

Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:39 pm  

cod'ead wrote:

It does make you wonder if the Dutch had gone about flood prevention and water management in the same cack-handed, penny-pinching way we had, Amsterdam would probably be the new Atlantis

They had no choice, because places were becoming like Atlantis. They weren't being flooded because of abnormally heavy rain but because the sodding sea was launching an attack. I'm pretty sure our "emergency avalanche fund" (if we have one) doesn't compare with Austria/Switzerland etc.

Re: Flooding in Tory voting areas ends the era of austerity : Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:44 pm  

This country is odd - Whenever we suffer any significant period of wet weather, we flood... Similarly, whenever we suffer a significant period of dry, warm weather, we go into drought/hosepipe ban mode.

Would it be too simple to suggest some sort of drainage/reservoir system is planned and built, where we are able to cope with, and store, any winter rain and then use the excess water in the summer to water our plants and wash our cars, until our hearts are content??....