Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:42 pm  

McLaren_Field wrote:

...PS - I still get upset when I listen to Puff the Magic Dragon, maybe we should concentrate on that poor soul instead, as far as I know he's still agoraphobic and in his cave.

Aye, but he is immortal, so he's got time to get over it.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:08 pm  

Mintball wrote:

Indeed. But setting aside that, why is faith itself held in such esteem or with such respect?

Serious question, BTW – to which I do not personally know the answer, even having had faith myself for much of my life.

I reckon the fundamental reason has always been the same. Humans are so egotistical, that they cannot conceive that when they die, that's it, what they experience as their 'self' ceases to be.

People are also so sentimental they simply do not want to believe that if their loved ones die, they cease to exist.

Add to that the obvious physical manifestation that here is the body of (say) what was your mother, but now it does not function, it is easy to see how an attractive explanation for that, which allows for your mother still to be "there", and "watching over you", would be that her "soul" is what's "left her body", and that's why she doesn't work any more, but in "spirit" she's just as much there as ever she was. It would be nice if that were true, and if you have what is to you a respected and all-knowing holy man that tells you yes it IS true. there is the key to religion. These people are the path to letting you speak to dead people, and arranging for you to be re-united.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:40 pm  

Back to the spurious claim that the influence of religion is not growing in the UK.

Back to the spurious claim that the influence of religion is not growing in the UK.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 2:18 pm  

Ferocious Aardvark wrote:

I reckon the fundamental reason has always been the same. Humans are so egotistical, that they cannot conceive that when they die, that's it, what they experience as their 'self' ceases to be.

People are also so sentimental they simply do not want to believe that if their loved ones die, they cease to exist.

Add to that the obvious physical manifestation that here is the body of (say) what was your mother, but now it does not function, it is easy to see how an attractive explanation for that, which allows for your mother still to be "there", and "watching over you", would be that her "soul" is what's "left her body", and that's why she doesn't work any more, but in "spirit" she's just as much there as ever she was. It would be nice if that were true, and if you have what is to you a respected and all-knowing holy man that tells you yes it IS true. there is the key to religion. These people are the path to letting you speak to dead people, and arranging for you to be re-united.

Then add to that the gene that has stood mankind in such good stead over the years, the gene that alerts him to everything, leading him to believe that everything has a reason.
So when he smells a lion, he knows to avoid that bit of the jungle.
Or, further North, when the sun becomes reluctant to shine for much of the day, he lights a fire to encourage it to come back ... it worked for him last year, can't see why it won't work this year ...

Then put him in a circumstance where the reason for something isn't apparent ... and he'll still come up with something.

Then start asking him awkward questions about his reasoning ... and the fairy tale becomes more and more elaborate ... ending up with God moving in mysterious ways and we shouldn't question it.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 2:20 pm  

Ferocious Aardvark wrote:

I reckon the fundamental reason has always been the same. Humans are so egotistical, that they cannot conceive that when they die, that's it, what they experience as their 'self' ceases to be.

People are also so sentimental they simply do not want to believe that if their loved ones die, they cease to exist.

Add to that the obvious physical manifestation that here is the body of (say) what was your mother, but now it does not function, it is easy to see how an attractive explanation for that, which allows for your mother still to be "there", and "watching over you", would be that her "soul" is what's "left her body", and that's why she doesn't work any more, but in "spirit" she's just as much there as ever she was. It would be nice if that were true, and if you have what is to you a respected and all-knowing holy man that tells you yes it IS true. there is the key to religion. These people are the path to letting you speak to dead people, and arranging for you to be re-united.

A slightly flippant point (flippant - me ?) but we have a paradox situation on TV where religious worship programmes are permitted on a sunday (are the BBC still obligated to provide one ?) during which I'm sure that some mention is made to everlasting souls and other such balderdash, and yet when Colin Fry or John Edwards try and present a programme on The Living Channel where they claim to speak to dead people the TV company are obligated to prefix the show with a warning that basically says that these people are charlatans and its only to be taken with a pinch of salt for amusement purposes.

Now either you can speak to dead people or you can't, there is either life after death or there isn't, surely this isn't some form of double standard from the broadcasting commissioners ?

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:34 pm  

So that little lad who used to knock about with Bruce Willis couldn't really see dead people?

It's a dream shattering factory this forum.

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:39 pm  

Sandra The Terrorist wrote:

So that little lad who used to knock about with Bruce Willis couldn't really see dead people?

It's a dream shattering factory this forum.

i don't know how to put his, but - Bruce Willis doesn't actually exist

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:42 pm  

Ferocious Aardvark wrote:

i don't know how to put his, but - Bruce Willis doesn't actually exist

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:49 pm  

El Barbudo wrote:

Aye, but he is immortal, so he's got time to get over it.

What about poor Jackie Paper, will nobody think of the children?

Re: Prevent The Church Hijacking Our Schools : Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:56 pm  

Ferocious Aardvark wrote:

i don't know how to put his, but - Bruce Willis doesn't actually exist

That's right, he's just a fictional character. His real name is John McClane.