Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 1:51 pm  

King Street Cat wrote:

As Strinket said on another thread, you are The Male Online.

And as you said, you had the same "education" as Ben Westwood, so your opinion counts for little in my eyes.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 1:54 pm  

Brilliant & accurate. Though I never had Ron Mael from Sparks as a Male reader.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 1:59 pm  

God this site is boring with all the socialists ruining any and every thread, allwy cat, kitten tot, it's a blumin farce.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 2:22 pm  

MGarbutt1986 wrote:

God this site is boring with all the socialists ruining any and every thread, allwy cat, kitten tot, it's a blumin farce.

Can I suggest you go to Mail Online? You will find just what you are looking for there.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 3:58 pm  

tigertot wrote:

Can I suggest you go to Mail Online? You will find just what you are looking for there.

No, quite happy here, thanks. it's called democracy, something you maybe want to read up on.

I never realised being a socialist, old idiot all came together. But then I should have seen that with Cringebin.

[Pumpetypump]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:18 pm  

This thread has remained remarkably polite given the subject matter so let's not have it trashed by name calling. Pretty please.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:29 pm  

MGarbutt1986 wrote:

God this site is boring

MGarbutt1986 wrote:

No, quite happy here, thanks.

[Wanderer]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:16 pm  

I was thinking much the same.

[Mild Rover]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:56 pm  

Cronus wrote:

She's not wrong though. Throughout, MPs from all parties have put their own individual agendas ahead of reaching a reasonable agreement with the EU. Strings of ridiculous amendments and blocking mechanisms have done nothing but weaken our position.

Even now, when agreement is urgently needed, they cannot help but waffle on more about general elections and other irrelevant rubbish than solving the issue at hand.

Cross party would never have worked, as proven by Corbyn's childish reaction yesterday.

So tough titties to any poor offended MPs I'm afraid. Play your games and pray you have a job next time round, because the anger is palpable and frankly they deserve all the scorn being poured their way.

Corbyn’s behaviour yesterday was pathetic. But attempts at cross party would have probably been scuppered anyway by a mutiny in the Tory ranks. I’m frustrated that May has tailored a deal to try to meet the demands of group that don’t want a realistic deal, but the problem is systemic - she couldn’t really do anything very different.

With a few dishonourable exceptions, this isn’t about politicians being abnormally horrible or incompetent. It is more a systems failure.

The anger may be palpable, but not all indignation is righteous or well-directed. That doesn’t make it any less dangerous, but it makes it pretty much impossible to address in a sensible or constructive way.

A series of decisions, which each individually could be seen as rational from the decision-maker’s perspective, have together brought to the brink of national calamity. And it is easier to make sense of things if there is a villain, and we can blame somebody else. So people probably will. I think we all ought to take ownership of this mess - we won’t, but we should.

The heads of the CBI and TUC were on the news together urging the Govt to take a new direction. Maybe that’s the green shoots. We’ve shafted ourselves, but perhaps we’ll learn from it. Catastrophes have led to positive changes at times in the past... and further catastrophes at others, admittedly.

I’m glad I bought all that bog-roll, I tell you!

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:26 pm  

bren2k wrote:

That's an interesting take - even the hardest of hard Brexiteers don't agree with her handling of it - and place significant blame at her feet for the impasse we've arrived at; so quite how you can apportion it all to "MP's," but exonerate the universally vilified PM, is quite a leap, even for you.

This whole thing is borne out of Mrs May's absolute refusal to put the national interest ahead of keeping her knackered old party together; if she'd worked cross-party on something that could achieve a majority from the get-go, it would be done and dusted by now - instead, she allowed the ERG and the DUP to hold her to ransom in pursuit of a vanishingly small majority, and has singularly failed to listen, learn or adapt when her approach was rejected on a historic level.

The only good that could come of this, is that it could destroy the Tories as an electoral prospect for years to come.

Of course the hardest Brexiteers don't agree with her handling of it. Neither do the hardest Remainers. Or the reasonably hard Brexiteers or reasonably hard Remainers. Or those with their own individual ideas of what Brexit should look like. Do you see the point?

There is simply no deal that would satisfy everyone, indeed probably never enough to get voted through. Any deal brought back by anyone was always going to be rejected initially. However I'm dismayed so few MPs are still willing to see sense and get a deal that can do a reasonable job in place.

Cross-party would have made zero difference, because it's not a party issue. The challenges would have been the same and we'd have seen more, not fewer departures from the decision-making group due to the inevitable and additional friction this would have brought. Christ, Corbyn can't handle cross-party talks even now unless they're strictly on his terms.

So yes, I lambaste all MPs (or at least all those unwilling to compromise) for dragging us all through further pain and making weak, agenda-driven excuses instead of getting on with the job they're feckin well supposed to do.