Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Tue Aug 06, 2019 5:43 am  

wotsupcas wrote:

But by your logic even less voted to stay!

Womder of he'd apply the samelogic to Trade Union votes.

Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Tue Aug 06, 2019 7:41 am  

tigertot wrote:

You forget that the people of this country have had enough of experts.

Yes they have and in some cases, with good reason.
However, The governor of the Bank of England, is as close to impartial as we have and although economists do frequently get things wrong, i'll take his forecast above all of the political commentators, many of whom have their own agenda.
If Mark Carney tells us that a no deal Brexit will lead to an economic shock, we would be wise to take note, especially when the voices disputing this are doing so for political reasons.

Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:40 am  

wrencat1873 wrote:

Yes they have and in some cases, with good reason.
However, The governor of the Bank of England, is as close to impartial as we have and although economists do frequently get things wrong, i'll take his forecast above all of the political commentators, many of whom have their own agenda.
If Mark Carney tells us that a no deal Brexit will lead to an economic shock, we would be wise to take note, especially when the voices disputing this are doing so for political reasons.

Sorry to be repetitive but just Google Mark Carney gets it wrong. Plenty of bed time reading there! Don't just slavishly accept as gospel anything that is anti Brexit.... Most of it is bs

Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Wed Aug 07, 2019 7:49 am  

The former US treasury secretary Larry Summers has said he does not believe that a “desperate” UK would manage to secure a post-Brexit trade deal with Washington, as Dominic Raab, the new foreign secretary, heads to the US to scope out the potential for such an agreement.

Summers, who was a senior official under Bill Clinton and Barack Obama, said the UK was in a weak position when it came to negotiating with trade partners.

He told BBC Radio 4’s Today programme on Tuesday: “Britain has no leverage, Britain is desperate … it needs an agreement very soon. When you have a desperate partner, that’s when you strike the hardest bargain.”


Despite warm words from Donald Trump about a trade deal, Summers said: “We have economic conflict with China and, even on top of that, the deterioration of the pound is going to further complicate the negotiating picture.

“We will see it as giving Britain an artificial comparative advantage and make us think about the need to retaliate against Britain, not to welcome Britain with new trade agreements.”

Even if the two countries could come to an agreement, Summers said, the UK was in a weak negotiating position.

“Britain has much less to give than Europe as a whole did, therefore less reason for the United States to make concessions,” he said. “You make more concessions dealing with a wealthy man than you do dealing with a poor man.”



What this prat doesn't realise is that us Brits have pluckiness. And optimism. Pluckiness in spades & optimism in buckets. We didn't get an Empire, win 2 World Wars & a World Cup without pluckiness. And optimism.

Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Wed Aug 07, 2019 8:43 am  

wotsupcas wrote:

Sorry to be repetitive but just Google Mark Carney gets it wrong. Plenty of bed time reading there! Don't just slavishly accept as gospel anything that is anti Brexit.... Most of it is bs

Come on, what about the pro Brexit stuff.
EVERY aspect of Brexit has been a wish list.
Apart from having autonomy over our law making (although we will still have to comply with the rules and regs for all goods and services supplied to countries within the EU), EVERTYTHING else is pure fiction.
So desperate are we to seal a trade deal with Trump, that we will be lucky to come out of those negotiations still wearing any clothes.
For all that I despise Trump, the one thing that he is pretty good at, is negotiating and when you know that the other party is desperate, you can screw them over - big time.
Remember, we're not out yet and if you want a measure of the worlds confidence in the UK, just take a peek at the value of the pound and baring in mind that the UK runs a huge trade deficit, this leads directly to inflation.
Our economy is already close to flat lining and the clowns in Downing Street are wanting to leave with "no deal", something that even they acknowledge will cause an economic shock.
Also, IF Carney is so bad, why would he still be at the helm of the Bank of England ??

Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Wed Aug 07, 2019 4:58 pm  

Interesting but dangerous times ahead. Unless things change dramatically we will leave the EU in October, whilst Labour and others are castigating Johnson for a so called no deal brexit. The fact of the matter is May agreed a deal with the EU who have consistently stated it’s the only deal on offer. Also it’s not open for further negotiations, including the Irish backstop, May brought this deal back and parliament voted it down 3 times. The no deal scenario was set in place when parliament rightly or wrongly voted the May deal down. The dangerous part is Varadkar claiming a United Irish republic might solve the situation, he may regret letting that genie out of the bottle. Balance of probabilities will be a general election, it’s virtually impossible to rule without a reasonable majority. No legislation can be passed so Johnson will be forced to go the country. The Tory’s will have a good old fashioned clear out. Grieve, Wollaston, soubry, and a few others will be deselected. Jezza thinks he can win an election, if the brexiit brigade team up with the Tory’s ,Labour could well be defeated. The only party with any optimism is the lib dems. Be ironic if they held the balance in parliament .

Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Wed Aug 07, 2019 5:30 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

Come on, what about the pro Brexit stuff.
EVERY aspect of Brexit has been a wish list.
Apart from having autonomy over our law making (although we will still have to comply with the rules and regs for all goods and services supplied to countries within the EU), EVERTYTHING else is pure fiction.
So desperate are we to seal a trade deal with Trump, that we will be lucky to come out of those negotiations still wearing any clothes.
For all that I despise Trump, the one thing that he is pretty good at, is negotiating and when you know that the other party is desperate, you can screw them over - big time.
Remember, we're not out yet and if you want a measure of the worlds confidence in the UK, just take a peek at the value of the pound and baring in mind that the UK runs a huge trade deficit, this leads directly to inflation.
Our economy is already close to flat lining and the clowns in Downing Street are wanting to leave with "no deal", something that even they acknowledge will cause an economic shock.
Also, IF Carney is so bad, why would he still be at the helm of the Bank of England ??

Didn't say Carney was that bad. Just used him as an example of how these financial experts get it consistently wrong. I notice you haven't refuted that fact. You may not think that getting our sovereignty back is important but I do. As I have stated in the past on here untruths and downright lies have been told on BOTH sides. The biggest one of all was by Heath back in the 70's telling us it was just a free trade agreement. This isn't just about economics to me but I do happen to believe after a short downturn we will be better off in the long run. I may be wrong but so, my friend, might you.

Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Thu Aug 08, 2019 8:20 am  

wotsupcas wrote:

Didn't say Carney was that bad. Just used him as an example of how these financial experts get it consistently wrong. I notice you haven't refuted that fact. You may not think that getting our sovereignty back is important but I do. As I have stated in the past on here untruths and downright lies have been told on BOTH sides. The biggest one of all was by Heath back in the 70's telling us it was just a free trade agreement. This isn't just about economics to me but I do happen to believe after a short downturn we will be better off in the long run. I may be wrong but so, my friend, might you.

Here we go again.
You didn't say he was "that bad" but you certainly questioned his judgement, as if to doubt that we will suffer an economic shock if a "no deal" exit happens on 31st October.
Yes, of course economists dont get it right every time, sometimes we are talking degrees of error and on other occasions, most notably the crash of 2007/2008 but, Carney is certainly viewed as a safe pair of hands and was asked to stay in his current position until Brexit was done.
As for Sovereignty, what exactly are you wanting/expecting post Brexit.
There will be no magical lightening bolt and even in the best case scenario, we will have some very difficult years ahead, with no guarantee of improvement in the long term.

We may be able to pass "our own laws" but, like it or not, Britain cannot survive on it's own and we will still have to satisfy EU regulations for any goods that we wish to supply over there.
Either we need to cosy up even closer to the US or still ally ourselves with The EU.
It was interesting a few weeks ago, that following the oil tanker seizure by the Iranians, Britain, no longer capable of fighting it's own quarter, instantly wanted help from Europe.

We have a decent sized ecconomy, these days, largely built on finance, something that our former "friends" in Europe will be desperate to take a slice of and remembering that much of our finance is actually servicing "European" money, they are likely to take some of this business and as outsiders, we will be powerless to prevent this, which wouldn't happen is we were within the EU.

You also have to think that Scotland will be striving harder still to gain their own independence which will weaken Britain's position still further.

Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Thu Aug 08, 2019 8:58 am  

Everyone have a cup of tea and laugh at John McDonnel, Cringebin's left hand man, and another Labour loser.

Re: Brexit Anyone? (part 4) : Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:29 am  

IR80 wrote:

Everyone have a cup of tea and laugh at John McDonnel, Cringebin's left hand man, and another Labour loser.

Surely you're not saying that he's better comedy value than our all new Prime Minister

In a class (cabinet) full of clowns, Boris is still the class clown and while he may be enthusiastic, gaffs are his speciality.
Let's hope that he never presses the wrong button, just to see what it does, ooops.

On his tour to bring the country together, he vexed of the Welsh, fell out with the scots and he seems happy to have the Irish bombing each other and yet you choose to take a swipe at Corbyn and McDonnel. Quality, I can see why you vote Tory and want Brexit