Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 4:24 pm  

Bullseye wrote: I'm sure you're right initially. I expect with the benefit of 50-100 years people will see the light. Right around the time Jacob Rees Mogg reckons it might be when we start to see whether it was worth it or not. https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... 86f48e3566 I'm very disappointed with the MSM. Their coverage of Brexit preparations has been woeful. There are lots of juicy stories too if they could drag themselves away from Westminster for a moment and do some digging. Fact is you can prepare your backside off for no deal but it would cost far more than the £5bn already put aside for it to do it anywhere near properly. At some point you have to ask if it's so expensive and time consuming why do it? It's like building another Titanic to be the lifeboat for the Titanic when we could just avoid the iceberg. I promise no more Titanic analogies now. I agree that the coverage of the implications of Brexit have been woeful. However, there has been wild exaggeration about empty shelves etc. As with most supply and demand situations, most things can be overcome by throwing additional resources at any particular situation and on the basis that there will be suppliers wanting to maintain supplies and customers wanting those goods, although there will be some disruption, most things will find a new level pretty damn quickly and any opportunities that arise form and inability to supply, for whatever reason, will quickly be filled. My company has certainly increased stock from overseas to overcome the short term, although these goal posts do look to have moved (or being on the move) and the key will be in stock piling essential supplies, to overcome any short term issues. The media love a crisis and they always seem desperate to create one wherever possible. From Brexit to weather, climate change, immigration etc, etc - these are al real issues but, we dont get balanced reporting on so many stories.

Bullseye wrote: I'm sure you're right initially. I expect with the benefit of 50-100 years people will see the light. Right around the time Jacob Rees Mogg reckons it might be when we start to see whether it was worth it or not. https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... 86f48e3566 I'm very disappointed with the MSM. Their coverage of Brexit preparations has been woeful. There are lots of juicy stories too if they could drag themselves away from Westminster for a moment and do some digging. Fact is you can prepare your backside off for no deal but it would cost far more than the £5bn already put aside for it to do it anywhere near properly. At some point you have to ask if it's so expensive and time consuming why do it? It's like building another Titanic to be the lifeboat for the Titanic when we could just avoid the iceberg. I promise no more Titanic analogies now. I agree that the coverage of the implications of Brexit have been woeful. However, there has been wild exaggeration about empty shelves etc. As with most supply and demand situations, most things can be overcome by throwing additional resources at any particular situation and on the basis that there will be suppliers wanting to maintain supplies and customers wanting those goods, although there will be some disruption, most things will find a new level pretty damn quickly and any opportunities that arise form and inability to supply, for whatever reason, will quickly be filled. My company has certainly increased stock from overseas to overcome the short term, although these goal posts do look to have moved (or being on the move) and the key will be in stock piling essential supplies, to overcome any short term issues. The media love a crisis and they always seem desperate to create one wherever possible. From Brexit to weather, climate change, immigration etc, etc - these are al real issues but, we dont get balanced reporting on so many stories.

[Bullseye]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 5:47 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

I agree that the coverage of the implications of Brexit have been woeful. However, there has been wild exaggeration about empty shelves etc.

All I can really comment on with any authority is how it would affect the NHS. It's about a lot more than just supply and demand of medicines.

[Mild Rover]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 5:49 pm  

You know what? It’s late in the day, but fair play to her on her latest offer. If she is serious, then I hope Corbyn isn’t a wally about it.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:39 pm  

bren2k wrote:

I've said before and I'll say again - there was lots of pointless rhetoric on both sides; that said, we're hardly in a great place economically are we, despite the spin; the value of the £ has tanked, GDP has risen slightly but that doesn't help inequality, and employment is up, but only because the govt fiddle the figures to exclude lots of people, and to include people who work 1 hour a week on a zero hour contract. Meanwhile, public services are slashed to the bone, the NHS, police, fire service and schools are virtually crippled, homelessness is up, and the number of children living in absolute poverty has risen.

Which laws negatively impacted you? What don't you like about immigration? How much of the EU contribution was wasted do you think?

See you're doing exactly what I described - we *could* do better deals; as an independent, largely irrelevant island that is no longer the gateway to the European market, you expect the growing Tiger economies to bend over for us? They may well offer trade deals - but they'll want favourable tarrifs, relaxation of standards and protections, and probably a shitload of visas. And it will take years to resolve, as these things do.

It's fantasy land.

To you it is and you are entitled to that opinion - there are plenty of countries that trade very successfully with the EU that aren't members - these "Tiger" countries don't appear to have issues and they are growing at a far more rapid rate than any country in the EU.

The EU economy is in a better state than any of the larger countries in Europe - Germany is about to go into recession and France is a complete basket case.

Inequality has happened despite membership of the EU how is staying in going to help that? The UK is unique in that respect it is a issue in every country. Perhaps if we weren't spending c9bn in sporting the likes of Bulgaria we would have more money to support our own people. You are grasping at straws in respect of unemployment - but that's your perrogative.

What do I not like about EU laws - that our own courts dont have the utimate jurisdiction - ask Italy how they feel about not being able to implement what they feel is best for their country because the EU suggests it breaks some of their laws. It would be great if the government were prepared. I think it would be a positive thing if the government could offer subsides to attract new business - sadly this is not allowed under EU rules.

The EU is a bloated beaurocracy filled with the unelected such as Tusk, Barnier so like any large organisation waste will be significant. I have no issue with immigration diversity is a good thing provided the behaviours/values that we espose are adopted.

The government has invested record amounts on the NHS and Education - you could invest the whole GDP of the economy country in the NHS and it will not be sufficient so what is enough how much should we invest and how do we pay for it?

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:41 pm  

Hopefully,we leave with a deal but i am sure the best deal would have been attained if Brexit was a cross party affair from the word go instead of allowing the EU to get the upper hand in negotiations, because the UK didn't provide a united front.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:47 pm  

wrencat1873 wrote:

This is ok but, necessarily, we are making it more difficult to trade with our closest and largest market, which is crazy.
Unless the promises of a free trade deal with the EU AND the ability to trade everywhere else with supremely beneficial trade deals, all of which will take multiple years to set up.
The picture sole by leave suggested zero down side and yet, our current government's new best buddies (the DUP) seem to have a significantly different view and the Irish Border certainly wasn't mentioned during the referendum campaign (by either side).
The deal with the EU has to give the UK less preferential terms (if only to prevent other countries from trying to leave) and we still come back to a fundamental situation thet, there isn't a hope in hell of the UK using preferential trading terms with say India/ China, to gain commercial benefit, to supply certain good back into the EU - It wont happen.

Also, from the debacle that we have all witnessed so far (the negotiations with the EU 27), do you really think that the UK will do better then the EU when negotiating with the "rest of the world" ? really ?

I think we would be more agile - how is the EU's deal going with the US!! guarantee we would have a deal sorted quicker and on similar terms to the EU. Has the EU got advantageous terms compared to any other smaller country?

The EU is slow growth area - why would consider this a better option than dealing with the likes of India/China etc in the longer term?

The UK is the EU largest single market perhaps it is in their interest also to do a preferential deal with us?

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:09 pm  

Mild Rover wrote:

You know what? It’s late in the day, but fair play to her on her latest offer. If she is serious, then I hope Corbyn isn’t a wally about it.

Let’s hope Corbyn is smarter than you and sees this for the trap it is.

Whether Brexit does or doesn’t happen as a result of this ‘meeting’, I’ll guarantee you that the blame will be laid at the door of Corbyn/Labour by the MSM.

He should call another vote of no confidence.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:14 pm  

Which laws negatively impacted you?

It’s bigger than affecting one person, it’s how it affects the country as a whole. The EU has done great things when it comes to safety and the environment, but it’s a giant beast that is running away with itself. The EU has brought in the Marrakesh Political Declaration and this will affect every single one of us, it’s a declaration to make it easier for Africans to migrate to EU countries albeit legally, it will flood the labour market with Africans whether you be a Doctor, police officer, IT worker, train driver, civil servant etc there will be more people in this country as a result and more people using the infrastructure.

What don't you like about immigration?

The fact that it floods he market with cheap labour keeping wages down, and don’t quote the rise of the minimum wage, I’m talking people who don’t earn minimum wage like tradesmen. If the minimum wage keeps rising we will all be on it. Prior to 2004 when Poland joined the EU I knew a lot of gangs (no, not the stabby drug dealing type, I mean brick layers, plumbers, sparkys etc) who would go down to London for work but with the influx of foreign labour this made these tradesmen stop up North saturating the labour market, then the foreign workers came North too and again saturated the labour market. So by saturating the labour market you keep wages low.

How much of the EU contribution was wasted do you think[/b][/b]?

What about the 114 Million euros a year it costs to move from Brussels to Strasbourg once a month.

[Mild Rover]

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:49 pm  

Strinket wrote:

Let’s hope Corbyn is smarter than you and sees this for the trap it is.

Whether Brexit does or doesn’t happen as a result of this ‘meeting’, I’ll guarantee you that the blame will be laid at the door of Corbyn/Labour by the MSM.

He should call another vote of no confidence.

I did say ‘if she is serious’. I’d like to think that even she wouldn’t rock up to the meeting just expecting him to provide Labour support for MV4.

Yes, it’s a trap in one sense. He’ll get the blame for facilitating a Tory Brexit on the one hand, and for it being too soft on the other. It’s an absolute shizzle time to be a political leader, and his ambitions will likely go the same way May’s have. She is, of course, asking him to sup from the poisoned cup that Cameron handed her. But the alternative is No Deal, so he is trapped anyway.

I don’t want to see him get Clegged, and i’d have preferred the tories to own this. However, that’s life and maybe this is a chance for both of them to go out as heroes, martyred on the political pyre that is Brexit. I think they’d deserve a commemorative mug, emblazoned with both their faces.

Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3) : Tue Apr 02, 2019 9:16 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

The remain campaign said the economy would collapse and we would need an emergency budget with a hike in tax rates if we voted to leave. Something you appear to have omitted from your post? Or are you suggesting that didn't happen?

That could still happen, we haven’t left yet, if we leave without a deal the economy will more than likely go into a recession.