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Re: Zero hours contracts : Tue Aug 20, 2013 4:53 pm  
Am I right in saying that in GB the shareholders, by law, come first, re profits, whilst in Germany the workers, the home base i.e keeping work within the town etc, all have to be taken into consideration before cutting wages / hiving off the profitable portions of the company to overseas.
If so, it's a no brainer why things are better for the workers over there.

Anyone know if this is true ?
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Re: Zero hours contracts : Tue Aug 20, 2013 11:38 pm  
Don't know about the above but it is certainly harder to lay people off. Can't remember whether it's 6 or 12 months notice and the company has to help the employee find new work either within their organisation or elsewhere. Rules in Switzerland are similar.

All that regulation must be killing the Swiss and German economies! (Not).
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Re: Zero hours contracts : Wed Aug 21, 2013 8:01 am  
Not sure this is 100% reliable but it chimes-in with conversations I've had with German colleagues ...

http://worldemploymentlaw.com/Germany-N ... eriod.html
Not sure this is 100% reliable but it chimes-in with conversations I've had with German colleagues ...

http://worldemploymentlaw.com/Germany-N ... eriod.html
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Re: Zero hours contracts : Wed Aug 21, 2013 1:34 pm  
El Barbudo wrote:
You might well be right.


I had completely lost interest in this thread after Mintball completely boshed it as usual when anyone doesn't bow down to her pronouncements!!

Back on topic - I have stated my view on zero hour contracts i.e. completely unnecessary - a sympton of lazy management.
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Re: Zero hours contracts : Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:44 pm  
Sal Paradise wrote:
I had completely lost interest in this thread after Mintball completely boshed it as usual when anyone doesn't bow down to her pronouncements!!

Back on topic - I have stated my view on zero hour contracts i.e. completely unnecessary - a sympton of lazy management.

You have omitted to comment on why Germany, despite having many, many of the sort of rules that, in your opinion would ruin a country's economy, is nonetheless nowhere near being an economic basket case.
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Re: Zero hours contracts : Wed Aug 21, 2013 6:03 pm  
El Barbudo wrote:
I'm not clear what this bit means.
Did Staedtler own Cumberland back then?


Yes in late 60's or early 70's
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Re: Zero hours contracts : Wed Aug 21, 2013 6:18 pm  
El Barbudo wrote:
You have omitted to comment on why Germany, despite having many, many of the sort of rules that, in your opinion would ruin a country's economy, is nonetheless nowhere near being an economic basket case.


Germany is not here, the culture is very different to compare is like comparing apples to oranges, yes they are fruit but that is as far as meaningful comparison goes. Why not compare Germany to China? it simply cannot be done with any sense of gravitas. What works in one country is not necessarily transferrable to another.
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Re: Zero hours contracts : Wed Aug 21, 2013 8:32 pm  
JerryChicken wrote:
Great memories, there's nothing quite like taking a new pencil out of the box for the first time, better still if its one of those pencils that are just sticks of wood with no sharpened end yet, better even still if you have one of those old pencil sharpeners that clamp to a desk and mechanically grip the pencil while you turn a handle to sharpen it - the points you get on those are lethal :D

And there is a world of difference between a cheap pencil and a "good" one and you usually find that out when you try and sharpen it - its all trivial and silly I know but they are tools to me and a good one is like finding a good chisel that you never want to lose or lend to anyone.


One of the problems with pencils is that the lead can break inside the pencil if it falls on a hard floor. This means that when sharpened the point can keep breaking away. Eagle invented and patented a method of bonding the lead to the wood so that the lead could flex and not break on impact (chemi-sealed) This meant although more expensive to buy the Eagle pencil lasted much longer and was in fact better and cheaper in the long run.

To demonstrate and prove this to unbelieving teachers we used to bash an Eagle pencil on the desk and then throw it on the floor with gusto before slitting open the pencil to show the unbroken lead inside.

I remember one NUT Easter conference (at Blackpool or perhaps the Isle of Man) when we had a stand in the exhibition hall where teachers could updated their knowledge of books and educational equipment. Our stand was on the first floor balcony and a colleague was in full flow demonstrating a "chemi-sealed" pencil to a group of teachers and was a little more enthusiastic than usual as he threw the pencil onto the hardwood floor where it bounced on its end and flew into the air and over the balcony railings. It continued its fall landing at the feet of a snooty publisher on a book stand below. It may have been the Oxford University Press, Macmillan or similar.

It should be pointed out at this stage that the sales personel of these publishers were a snooty lot that considered getting their hands dirty by actually selling was beneath them and they always looked down their noses at those of us from the educational equipment companies that didn't have such hang ups. Any way this 'book rep' was so annoyed that his peace and quite had been disturbed that he chose to throw the offending pencil back. It sailed up from the ground floor and back over the railings to land at the feet of my colleague who cooly continued his pitch, picking up the pencil cutting it open to show the proof to the astonished and open mouthed teachers.

Throughout the rest of the weekend we had groups of teachers coming onto our stand for an encore.
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Re: Zero hours contracts : Wed Aug 21, 2013 8:56 pm  
Has the well-deserved backlash started?

Hovis workers vote to strike over zero-hours contracts
Has the well-deserved backlash started?

Hovis workers vote to strike over zero-hours contracts
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Re: Zero hours contracts : Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:09 pm  
Sal Paradise wrote:
Germany is not here, the culture is very different to compare is like comparing apples to oranges, yes they are fruit but that is as far as meaningful comparison goes. Why not compare Germany to China? it simply cannot be done with any sense of gravitas. What works in one country is not necessarily transferrable to another.


No you can't compare Germany to China. Or the UK to China. To suggest you can't compare the UK to Germany is ridiculous. In terms of trading and employment legislation, economic development and culture we have far more in common than we have differences. The fact there are differences in the way employment works over there despite the similarities is the very thing that needs to be understood and and learned from but it is certainly not meaningless to make such comparisons.
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