Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:16 am  

Rock God X wrote:

Kosh wrote:

It's a sad reflection on politics in the UK when the 'best' we can muster as party leaders are Milliband, Clegg, and Cameron. Not a statesman among them.

I don't think it's just the UK. Look at Berlusconi or Sarkozy. Even Obama has been much less effective on the international stage than his campaign promised. Though when you look at some of the Republican candidates for the US Presidency, he looks positively awe-inspiring by comparison.

yeh,definitely a world wide thing - I can't recall a real french statesman since De Gaulle,Giscard,Barre and Pompidou
France seems full of sh@t stirrers like Cohn Bendit but not much else - Sarko is probably as outspoken as they come which is a sad endightment on french politics...

that's why the floating voter is seriously considering Marine le Pen as an alternative.....

Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:30 am  

Rock God X wrote:

Kosh wrote:

It's a sad reflection on politics in the UK when the 'best' we can muster as party leaders are Milliband, Clegg, and Cameron. Not a statesman among them.

I don't think it's just the UK. Look at Berlusconi or Sarkozy. Even Obama has been much less effective on the international stage than his campaign promised. Though when you look at some of the Republican candidates for the US Presidency, he looks positively awe-inspiring by comparison.

Who needs statesmen, when we're gradually handing over the keys of power to unelected bankers?

Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:46 am  

Mintball wrote:

Rock God X wrote:

Kosh wrote:

It's a sad reflection on politics in the UK when the 'best' we can muster as party leaders are Milliband, Clegg, and Cameron. Not a statesman among them.

I don't think it's just the UK. Look at Berlusconi or Sarkozy. Even Obama has been much less effective on the international stage than his campaign promised. Though when you look at some of the Republican candidates for the US Presidency, he looks positively awe-inspiring by comparison.

Who needs statesmen, when we're gradually handing over the keys of power to unelected bankers?

cynical,but probably true......

Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:55 am  

sanjunien wrote:

cynical,but probably true......

We can see it quite specifically in Greece and Italy, and I don't think many other decisions being made by governments across Europe today are being made without recourse to what finance wants.

As I've mentioned, while I do think Cameron's decision to keep the UK out of the proposed deal was the right one, I very much doubt that it was made for what I'd consider the right decisions, but instead, to keep happy his friends in the City.

Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:02 pm  

Mintball wrote:

As I've mentioned, while I do think Cameron's decision to keep the UK out of the proposed deal was the right one, I very much doubt that it was made for what I'd consider the right decisions, but instead, to keep happy his friends in the City.

Election campaigns, battle buses and private jets don't fund themselves - I believe the phrase is "you've got to dance with them that brought you".

Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:16 pm  

Andy Gilder wrote:

Mintball wrote:

As I've mentioned, while I do think Cameron's decision to keep the UK out of the proposed deal was the right one, I very much doubt that it was made for what I'd consider the right decisions, but instead, to keep happy his friends in the City.

Election campaigns, battle buses and private jets don't fund themselves - I believe the phrase is "you've got to dance with them that brought you".

Well indeed – anyone remember who funded Andrew Lansley?

Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:12 pm  

Mintball wrote:

Andy Gilder wrote:

Mintball wrote:

As I've mentioned, while I do think Cameron's decision to keep the UK out of the proposed deal was the right one, I very much doubt that it was made for what I'd consider the right decisions, but instead, to keep happy his friends in the City.

Election campaigns, battle buses and private jets don't fund themselves - I believe the phrase is "you've got to dance with them that brought you".

Well indeed – anyone remember who funded Andrew Lansley?

I guess you are referring to the perfectly respectable donations to his election fund by a chap who was on the board of a private medical company?
No conflict of interest there surely?

Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:19 pm  

McLaren_Field wrote:

Rock God X wrote:

Kosh wrote:

Wnidyone2012 wrote:

So Gordon " Don't panic brown" is a testament to this is he?

Brown was never PM material IMO. Still a better one that Cameron when it comes to diplomacy though.

I think Brown got a harsh deal as PM. Blair stepped down just as things were about to get ugly, and whoever inherited that particular shitsandwich was going to struggle. I don't agree with everything (or even most things) Brown said or did, but I do think he had far more integrity than Cameron.

Played a blinder did Blair, had Brown knocking on his bedroom door every morning for five years like a kid asking if it was christmas yet and was it today that he gets to be Prime Minister as promised, and all the while Blair was riding the wave until the last minute when he, but no-one else, could see it all starting to fall down - "Here's the keys Gordon, I've not left a forwarding address..."

To be fair to Blair, if Brown didnt see it coming then who would?

I thought Brown did a good job in the wake of Lehmans, but it was astonishing the way that he genuinely did seem to have believed his guff about ending boom and bust.

Unfortunately I thought his integrity died along with the 10p tax rate.

Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:39 pm  

Mintball wrote:

sanjunien wrote:

cynical,but probably true......

We can see it quite specifically in Greece and Italy, and I don't think many other decisions being made by governments across Europe today are being made without recourse to what finance wants.

As I've mentioned, while I do think Cameron's decision to keep the UK out of the proposed deal was the right one, I very much doubt that it was made for what I'd consider the right decisions, but instead, to keep happy his friends in the City.

not to mention the electorate of course......

[Kosh]

Re: What now for the UK? : Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:56 pm  

Andy Gilder wrote:

Election campaigns, battle buses and private jets don't fund themselves - I believe the phrase is "you've got to dance with them that bought you".

Edited for clarity.