Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:23 pm  

Hull White Star wrote:

You really have no idea do you?? You either listen to all the propaganda or don't live in the real world along with the rest of the tories.

I have never revealed which political party I support.

Well my world involves going out and working to generate taxes to keep people who don't in benefits.

I would say that's the real world wouldn't you?

Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:34 pm  

No the real world for me is injecting a cancer drug every week, having to go to hospital once a month for infusions, napping most of the day, not being able to physically walk far, having to have spouse help you wipe your bottom, being so out of it on morphine, having 3 prosthtic joints and having an ankle fused.

That's the real world for me that live everyday. You are an ignorant and arrogant man if you believe people like me don't deserve any help after paying into the system for nearly 20 years.

And show me where I said you were a tory? But you have certainly implied it.

Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:47 pm  

Hull White Star wrote:

No the real world for me is injecting a cancer drug every week, having to go to hospital once a month for infusions, napping most of the day, not being able to physically walk far, having to have spouse help you wipe your bottom, being so out of it on morphine, having 3 prosthtic joints and having an ankle fused.

That's the real world for me that live everyday. You are an ignorant and arrogant man if you believe people like me don't deserve any help after paying into the system for nearly 20 years.

And show me where I said you were a tory? But you have certainly implied it.

Firstly, irrespective of your politics I sympathise with your condition, I honestly do.

Right, now your use of "rest of the Tories" implies that I am one myself.

I might be, I might not be, but you don't know for certain.

I also did not say that people in your position don't deserve help. If you have paid in AND are in the situation that you find yourself in, I would think that you should be first in the queue for help.

Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:50 pm  

XBrettKennyX wrote:

Firstly, irrespective of your politics I sympathise with your condition, I honestly do.

Right, now your use of "rest of the Tories" implies that I am one myself.

I might be, I might not be, but you don't know for certain.

I also did not say that people in your position don't deserve help. If you have paid in AND are in the situation that you find yourself in, I would think that you should be first in the queue for help.

What if she hadn't "paid in"? Would she deserve no help?

Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:54 pm  

What about people disabled from birth, don't they deserve help because they havn't paid in?

Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:57 pm  

Yep, or young people who are unemployed.

Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:05 pm  

I don't need or want your sympathy. All I want in my time of need is a bit of help from the government which is what I was promised way back in the 40's when the welfare state was born. I paid my NI in full every month without fail so why can't the government reciprocate?

Do you think I gave up a good full time job for 96 quid a week because I wanted to?!!

Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:32 pm  

The defining factor of a civilised society is one which collects a levy from it citizens in order to provide a mutually agreeable level of public services (water, power, drainage, communications, roads, etc) as a bare minimum, the starter pack if you will.

The USA fits this description, they bought into the starter pack.

As a top up pack you can also add to the provisions a health pack (cradle to grave, free at the point of service), a pension pack (a basic state provision topped up by additional benefits), and a safety net of out of work benefits for when you hit those unforeseen moments in life, like your employer goes bust for instance.

The UK bought into all of those top up packs.


A civilised country should measure its esteem by the way it values its social provisions, supports its weak, and helps out those who are temporarily unemployed.

I find the USA model of "small government" very difficult to reconcile, I correspond with several American artists and find that they are all of the same opinion, that they will help themselves when in dire straits and they don't want a government to meddle in their affairs, even to the extent where they do not expect to receive medical treatment as a citizen right and if their neighbour dies because they didn't have enough or the right or kind or any medical insurance, then that is simply their fault and no-one elses concern - these are otherwise normal, kind, sharing folk and when I point out to them that if they come to the UK and are taken ill then they will be treated for free they all state without hesitation that they would refuse treatment, they will pay their way or have none at all.


Right now we have a perfect storm, rising unemployment coupled with three years of falling output and subsequent loss of tax revenue, and a government determined to use the American model as a "go forward" position either from dogged political belligerence or because they think its a quick fix to a financial position that is often exaggerated, over-estimated or simply invented for the sake of the next round of dogma.

I can't think of one week so far into this coalition's term when they haven't had a lie exposed, or done a U-turn, or just said stupid ill-conceived things, its like you're working for a company being managed by Mr Bean and as time goes on the gaffs will get bigger and the resentment will grow, either against their political parties, or from their supporters towards sectors of society who they have carefully presented as the cause of all evil, there are very similar undertones to that of Germany in the 1930s.

Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:36 pm  

XBrettKennyX wrote:

Page 18, second post up from the bottom.

Either you or someone has hacked your account it would appear..............

Ah. That.

Nope. Still entirely relevant.

Whinging that someone had made a "death threat" against you is entirely relevant to the Twitter joke trial.

Re: Coalition to break? : Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:38 pm  

XBrettKennyX wrote:

... I also did not say that people in your position don't deserve help ...

You just announced that, if she could get to a PC, she could do some work.

Talk about leaping to conclusions based on your prejudices, and without bothering about facts.

Oh and have a load of this before you whinge on about 'benefit fraud'.



And if you wish to challenge the stats represented simply here, then feel free – with evidence.