Re: British values : Thu Jun 12, 2014 12:45 am  

Euclid wrote:

Sorry you find personal experience to be so irrelevant.

That's a laugh. If you ever state what this personal experience actually is, then an opinion on its relevance could be formed. In what way does your unexplained personal experience make the self-explained situation of Pakistani Christians any better?

Re: British values : Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:21 am  

I have lived and worked in the Middle East. You, apparently, get your information from the internet. I have experience and you have a computer.

Re: British values : Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:40 am  

Euclid wrote:

I have lived and worked in the Middle East...

Euclid Wed Feb 19, 2014 9:49 pm wrote:

I think after 30 odd years watching, playing and coaching in the capital I am entitled to snipe. London Broncos is in real danger of not being my team any more.

You must have been busy.

Euclid wrote:

You, apparently, get your information from the internet. I have experience and you have a computer.

For goodness sake. If you truly are the oracle of all Middle Eastern knowledge, yea verily will I worship at your sacred feet, bathed in the glow of your infinite wisdom and knowledge of all things Middle Eastern cos you've been there for a bit, unworthy though I clearly am, if instead of pointless, pompous self-aggrandisement you would just address the fsckin question?

Re: British values : Thu Jun 12, 2014 12:50 pm  

Euclid wrote:

I have lived and worked in the Middle East. You, apparently, get your information from the internet. I have experience and you have a computer.

When you say "lived" were you living in and amongst the indigenous population, socialising, shopping, etc etc or were you like a couple of friends of mine "living" in a company compound with all requirements provided ?

I freely admit that my views on "living" in the middle east are based on those who pioneered "living" in the middle east in the 1970s when they were drilling for oil though, it may be different now that people don't have to get their hands dirty anymore and the locals have acquired more status.

Re: British values : Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:36 pm  

Jerry, for the most part I was living on the border of the Indian quarter in Abu Dhabi, near the old Gold Souk. I suspect things have changed a bit over the years. I had time to chat with a lot of construction workers from the sub continent. They certainly don't lead a luxurious life but they make a lot more than they can at home. I also spent free time in the Souk with the locals, work time with various security and police officers, officials and politicians. I was training their officers and officials in investigation, interview/interrogation techniques, threats from organised crime and so on. They were, in my experience, friendly and open minded, but I certainly hadn't realised how deep their religion runs through their lives. As I try to explain the rather testy Aardvark, it seemed to me very different to the stereotypical portrayal of both Arabs and Muslims our media presents us with.

Re: British values : Thu Jun 12, 2014 5:43 pm  

Ferocious Aardvark wrote:

You must have been busy.

For goodness sake. If you truly are the oracle of all Middle Eastern knowledge, yea verily will I worship at your sacred feet, bathed in the glow of your infinite wisdom and knowledge of all things Middle Eastern cos you've been there for a bit, unworthy though I clearly am, if instead of pointless, pompous self-aggrandisement you would just address the fsckin question?

Calm down dear.
Bit touchy aren't we? Perhaps you should get out from behind your keyboard a bit and do some real stuff?

Very touched by your searching of my posts, you must have plenty of time on your hands.

The phraseology about my Middle Eastern knowledge is all yours, not mine. I've just said that I've actually been there, worked, lived and found the reality of being in an Islamic country rather different to the way it's portrayed over here.

Not that controversial to get so wound up about, surely.

Re: British values : Fri Jun 13, 2014 1:47 am  

Euclid wrote:

Calm down dear.
Bit touchy aren't we? Perhaps you should get out from behind your keyboard a bit and do some real stuff?

Very touched by your searching of my posts, you must have plenty of time on your hands.

The phraseology about my Middle Eastern knowledge is all yours, not mine. I've just said that I've actually been there, worked, lived and found the reality of being in an Islamic country rather different to the way it's portrayed over here.

Not that controversial to get so wound up about, surely.

Have a word with yerself, will you? Rather than being "wound up", I was simply being blunt, not that it got through. You have said nothing at all, and won't explain what it is you mean. All you seem to think you're good at is being patronising. Which you certainly try hard at. Trouble is, it doesn't work, although it doesn't exactly show you in a good light. But you can't patronise me, and you haven't addressed my question.

Re: British values : Fri Jun 13, 2014 7:06 am  

What's life in the Middle East got to do with people having "British values" when living in Britain?

Re: British values : Fri Jun 13, 2014 9:42 am  

Dally wrote:

What's life in the Middle East got to do with people having "British values" when living in Britain?

TBF the OP (i.e. you) claimed:-

the fact that there is an inherent conflict between the Christian and Muslim views of the world

Re: British values : Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:15 pm  

Euclid wrote:

I have lived and worked in the Middle East. You, apparently, get your information from the internet. I have experience and you have a computer.

Got to admit, you're on the verge of adding a something useful but having followed this thread I'm still not sure what points you're trying to make.

You ask "How much do you actually know about Islam to enable you to say that there is an inherent conflict between Christian and Muslim views of the world?", but don't give us your view which, given that you've lived there, could be of interest. Others, in the meantime, have debated and supported their views.

As for "stereotypical portrayal of both Arabs and Muslims our media presents us with" - I'm also not sure what portrayal you mean and you again don't elaborate? It doesn't make for good discussion to make bold but essentially dead-end statements.

FWIW, I see a Middle East full of religious and civil unrest and in some cases all-out war. I also see filthy rich countries and extreme poverty. In my humble opinion, however, the majority of people are probably decent folk fed up with all that, avoiding it as best they can and just getting on with their lives. As for Islam, I believe some branches are indeed inherently in conflict with Christianity, and Western nations, simply because many of the more extreme branches preach hatred of all non-Muslims and intolerance of females and homesexuals, and are intent on implementing Sharia wherever they live. Some believe violence is the way to enforce their beliefs. Note: some, certainly not all.

And to be fair you've avoided FA's question throughout.