Re: Wizened old socialists : Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:33 am  

Jack Burton wrote:

The unions wil ask for a 10% pay increase for public sector workers (that isn't including teachers, or the NHS, as they're negotiated separately), as they do every year, but they will receive between 1% and 2%, as they do most years. They received a 2.5% annual increase a couple of years ago, which is the highest increase by far since the early 2000s.
Yes, unions have influence over the public sector, but the power they actually have is greatly overstated.

That is now but if we had got Corbyn in he would have caved - he has to they fund/own the party - no different to the Tories caving over their funders difference is with the Tories it is millions with Corbyn it would have been billions. He was talking about a £15/hour minimum wage!!

Re: Wizened old socialists : Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:53 am  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

That is now but if we had got Corbyn in he would have caved - he has to they fund/own the party - no different to the Tories caving over their funders difference is with the Tories it is millions with Corbyn it would have been billions. He was talking about a £15/hour minimum wage!!

Objection, mi lord, pure conjecture

On a serious note, wouldn't it be great if the minimum wage was £15 per hour - of course, it's all relative to the cost of living.
Two bottle tops a week would be fine, if they afforded you a decent standard of living.

Going back to Corbyn's £15 /hour. If it was tory policy, it would be described as "aspirational" but, if Corbyn suggested it, it's "the loony left"
Perception is indeed a curious thing.

Re: Wizened old socialists : Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:59 am  

Well, the US has raised their's to $15, and the government recommends paying a living wage of £9.50 at the moment, which is of course optional, and will increase again I'm sure, so a £10ph+ minimum wage isn't out of the question even under this government.

Re: Wizened old socialists : Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:40 pm  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

Who pays for it - no doubt ordinary tax payers - it has to be funded somehow?

It wont only be the NHS it will all public sector - do you think the likes of Unison, GMB and Unite are going to accept 0% when the NHS has had 15%? - your point remains naive and typical of your inability to see the wider picture - pretty typical of the vast majority of your posts.

Yes we'd need pay for it. That's how the public sector works. What's your point?
Well I suppose as big fans of deficit spending the Tories could just do a bit more of that. OR even fix up some corporation tax or inheritance tax loopholes.

Re: Wizened old socialists : Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:54 pm  

That's actually an issue Labour need to think about going forward. The Torries are probably more to the left than they are currently on the economy!

Re: Wizened old socialists : Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:14 pm  

Why do I keep thinking Selwyn Froggit when I see Johnson with his thumbs up and that look on his face.

Re: Wizened old socialists : Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:58 am  

wrencat1873 wrote:

Objection, mi lord, pure conjecture

On a serious note, wouldn't it be great if the minimum wage was £15 per hour - of course, it's all relative to the cost of living.
Two bottle tops a week would be fine, if they afforded you a decent standard of living.

Going back to Corbyn's £15 /hour. If it was tory policy, it would be described as "aspirational" but, if Corbyn suggested it, it's "the loony left"
Perception is indeed a curious thing.

£15/hour would be great as long as we all understand the consequences - inflation would be enormous as would unemployment. In Germany it €9.19 - less than us, France €9.67 almost the same. When you see these numbers you can see why £15 was indeed the loony left.

Re: Wizened old socialists : Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:02 am  

The Ghost of '99 wrote:

Yes we'd need pay for it. That's how the public sector works. What's your point?
Well I suppose as big fans of deficit spending the Tories could just do a bit more of that. OR even fix up some corporation tax or inheritance tax loopholes.

Can do very little in respect of CT as international companies have loopholes everywhere. IT is such a small number that it wouldn't even scratch the surface.

The only way this increase could be met is through direct personal taxation - any increase gives people less disposable income ie. the government decides how to spend a greater proportion of your income - as you know best you no doubt think this is a good idea (sic)

Re: Wizened old socialists : Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:25 am  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

Can do very little in respect of CT as international companies have loopholes everywhere. IT is such a small number that it wouldn't even scratch the surface.

The only way this increase could be met is through direct personal taxation - any increase gives people less disposable income ie. the government decides how to spend a greater proportion of your income - as you know best you no doubt think this is a good idea (sic)

Not true, putting Corporation Tax back to where it should be (25%) would generate billions; most UK companies don't avoid paying their taxes.

I also think income tax on higher earners should be nudged back up as well, lower levels are fine as they are although after I'd be willing to let some of the upper banding degrade slightly.

IHT take is about £5bn a year and is ridiculously enforced with the rich paying almost nothing thanks to efficient use of the myriad loopholes. Start to close them up and keep it tightly enforced and we'll start to see some progress.

Re: Wizened old socialists : Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:04 am  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

£15/hour would be great as long as we all understand the consequences - inflation would be enormous as would unemployment. In Germany it €9.19 - less than us, France €9.67 almost the same. When you see these numbers you can see why £15 was indeed the loony left.

Are you saying that people at the bottom should only aspire to make £10 / hour ??

What happened to "levelling up" or have you forgotten that one already ?