Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 7:07 am  

Hull White Star wrote:

I'll take a wild guess that you were born in Beverley Westwood NHS hospital and your parents didn't pay a penny for your birth because the state didn't get your mother pregnant did they? I'll take another wild guess and say that your parents didn't pay a fee for you at the state school South Hunsley that you went to either.

We all pay for the NHS - its not free, 'most' pay in a hell of lot more than we ever get out. Your above statement is factually incorrect as is your point about education!!

Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 9:29 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

We all pay for the NHS - its not free, 'most' pay in a hell of lot more than we ever get out. Your above statement is factually incorrect as is your point about education!!

She meant "free at the point of need" as you are fully aware.

Unfortunately contributing to the state is not some form of pick 'n' mix, where we can chose just what parts we'd like to make a contribution. I didn't agree with our invasion of Iraq but I never got a chance to withdraw my financial support in protest

Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 10:59 am  

cod'ead wrote:

She meant "free at the point of need" as you are fully aware.

Unfortunately contributing to the state is not some form of pick 'n' mix, where we can chose just what parts we'd like to make a contribution. I didn't agree with our invasion of Iraq but I never got a chance to withdraw my financial support in protest

Just because they don't give you bill doesn't mean its free it costs you just as much if not more over your lifetime - as you very well know. Personally I would rather pay pvt insurance and use when required.

Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:12 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

We all pay for the NHS - its not free, 'most' pay in a hell of lot more than we ever get out. Your above statement is factually incorrect as is your point about education!!

When you say most pay in a lot more than they get out, is that right? Most NHS spend occurs in a persons last year of life. The government is running a deficit which means tax revenues are less than overall expenditure. Most tax is paid by a relatively small proportion of people and so I am not sure it is correct to say most people pay in a lot more than they get out.

Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:15 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Just because they don't give you bill doesn't mean its free it costs you just as much if not more over your lifetime - as you very well know. Personally I would rather pay pvt insurance and use when required.

Would you? The reality of that is that the older you get the more expensive it would become to the stage where it would be costing tens of thousands of pounds per annum in your retirement. Not only that, should you get a chronic condition they would not insure you.

Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:17 pm  

The NHS is a great benefit to the UK economy. Without it businesses would be funding health insurance costs making our businesses less competitive. We already have higher property costs than most other places (other than Japan) so an extra burden would be very dangerous to our competitiveness,

Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:37 pm  

Some people will pay in more over their lifetime than what they receive in direct care/treatment etc. but that rightly goes toward treating those who fall ill. But private insurance cover does too.

And most private insurance providers in the UK don't cover everything, they certainly don't cover existing conditions and the vast majority still require the services of the NHS or their premiums would be a lot higher.

IIRC someone on the average wage pays roughly £900 a year through their tax and NI toward the NHS.
The best BUPA cover available, for a fit, healthy, non-smoker with no pre-existing conditions of any kind costs £89 per month (£1,068 per year) and doesn't cover everything the NHS does. Most notably A&E, maternity and urgent surgical procedures.

Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:38 pm  

Dally wrote:

The NHS is a great benefit to the UK economy. Without it businesses would be funding health insurance costs making our businesses less competitive. We already have higher property costs than most other places (other than Japan) so an extra burden would be very dangerous to our competitiveness,

So Employers NI is not funding some health costs? and these costs don't impact competitiveness

Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:45 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

So Employers NI is not funding some health costs? and these costs don't impact competitiveness

The tax take covers all sorts of things. Employers NI was just a convenient thing to hike up as a stealth tax to keep the headline income tax rate low. As the previous poster said, private insurance premiums would far outweigh the tax costs of the NHS if you could find comprehensive insurance cover. The only people a truly private medical insurance system would suit would be the mega-wealthy who could afford to pay for their medical care without resort to insurance. Oh, and the investors and executives in medical insurers.

The USA spends a lot more on healthcare than here despite enormous numbers of people having no decent care. A sick system.

Re: Ed Miliband Conference Speech : Wed Oct 01, 2014 12:56 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

So Employers NI is not funding some health costs? and these costs don't impact competitiveness

All NI receipts('ees and 'ers) total c. £107bn pa. Pensions and NHS (the two things you may perceive them as funding?) account for over £264 bn of government spending pa. So the "some" funding you mention is, like I said, cheap for business.