Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Mon Sep 03, 2012 9:15 pm  

Mintball wrote:

I find it aggravating that some seem to assume that, if you are doing okay yourself, you have to become a selfish git who doesn't care about anyone else. I hate to think that I could become like that. Why would I?

Quite apart from possessing a moral compass, it may just have something to do with actually experiencing life (as in real-world living, as opposed to Sal's "Real World" life) under Thatcher and even she didn't go as far as this lot in decimating the NHS and welfare

Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Mon Sep 03, 2012 9:46 pm  

cod'ead wrote:

I'm usually the one who Standee and Video Ref point towards, in their "politics of envy" rants.

In 2010 my aunt & uncle died within weeks of each other and as such, their estate was combined for IHT purposes. A cousin of mine was one of the executors and complained bitterly about the 40% IHT that was due on the balance above £650k. He also moaned about some of the beneficiaries, including my ex-wife. He seemed shocked when I told him that I couldn't give a flying fook who got what. It wasn't ever our money to start with, it had been earned by someone else. Basically this was simply money that had fallen out of the sky and as such, I didn't begrudge the exchequer taking their cut.

Is that the politics of envy?

What about the wishes of the deceased? Many parents work hard their entire lives to provide for their children, and that includes once they have passed. They take out savings funds and even amend the legalities regarding ownership of property to ensure the maximum sum possible is passed on to their loved ones.

100% tax on inheritance? Idealistic bllsht if you ask me. Why should the exchequer get a massive chunk of what parents have worked their fingers to the bone to pass on to their children? It's already been taxed - why does dying suddenly release that cash and those assets as some sort of tax bounty?

My parents are elderly and my mum has been in poor health for many years, though you wouldn't know it to meet her. One of their biggest concerns is that what they have worked all their lives for is passed on to myself and my sister, and they've taken financial advice several times to that effect. They're not hugely wealthy but they both had decent jobs, saved and invested well and my dad fell on his feet as far as voluntary retirement was concerned.

That inheritance will help provide a better life for my family. And in the same manner, I'll do my absolute damndest to ensure my kids get as much as possible once I've gone and frankly the exchequer can go whistle. I'm not a materialistic person at all - never been bothered about a fast car or the biggest TV or latest gadgets - but I do care about the security of my family's future.

Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Tue Sep 04, 2012 6:21 am  

Cronus wrote:

What about the wishes of the deceased? Many parents work hard their entire lives to provide for their children, and that includes once they have passed. They take out savings funds and even amend the legalities regarding ownership of property to ensure the maximum sum possible is passed on to their loved ones.

100% tax on inheritance? Idealistic bllsht if you ask me. Why should the exchequer get a massive chunk of what parents have worked their fingers to the bone to pass on to their children? It's already been taxed - why does dying suddenly release that cash and those assets as some sort of tax bounty?

My parents are elderly and my mum has been in poor health for many years, though you wouldn't know it to meet her. One of their biggest concerns is that what they have worked all their lives for is passed on to myself and my sister, and they've taken financial advice several times to that effect. They're not hugely wealthy but they both had decent jobs, saved and invested well and my dad fell on his feet as far as voluntary retirement was concerned.

That inheritance will help provide a better life for my family. And in the same manner, I'll do my absolute damndest to ensure my kids get as much as possible once I've gone and frankly the exchequer can go whistle. I'm not a materialistic person at all - never been bothered about a fast car or the biggest TV or latest gadgets - but I do care about the security of my family's future.

What about the wishes of the deceased?

They're dead, they are no longer sentient, presumably they died knowing the situation regarding IHT, so basically their wishes no longer count for anything.

Legacies are unearned income and are taxed as such. I really can't see the problem with IHT, especially when applied to increased property values. Just how hard does someone work to watch over an increase in house prices?

Oh and it wasn't me who suggested a 100% IHT rate BTW

Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Tue Sep 04, 2012 7:30 am  

Mintball wrote:

I find it aggravating that some seem to assume that, if you are doing okay yourself, you have to become a selfish git who doesn't care about anyone else. I hate to think that I could become like that. Why would I?

I admit that I've been there and I've seen it in others who have, through graft, acheived a level of income where the household bills can be paid without thinking "oooh thats a bit higher this quarter", there is an inate feeling that you've done well, you've done it yourself and you're self sufficient now.

Whereas of course you aren't, with a few years and some bad times on your back you learn that actually most of your success was just good luck and the bad times are all part of the parcel, and its in the bad times that you need to fall back on society for support.

I'm the first to admit that for 18 months during 2009/10 we relied on the tax credits that we applied for to pay the mortgage, if it hadn't been for those credits then we'd have been stuffed, just like the family were who bought our last house from us in 2007 and over-stretched themselves just before the recession hit - that house is now for sale by the mortgagee for £60k less than we sold it for and the family has had to move out - I'm under no illusion that that could easily have been us.

Independence from the state is an illusion created in young minds, its only after you properly mature that you realise how much you need a properly functioning public sector.

Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Tue Sep 04, 2012 12:11 pm  

I still find myself 'looking over my shoulder' these days, wondering if our improved fortunes will end and we'll be back where we were, which was, in effect, working poverty. Struggling to pay basic bills, very rare holidays (and often only because friends effectively subbed us), reliant all too often on 'the copper jar': forget decent clothes – cheap stuff off the market, which only lasted a short time anyway.

I never, ever want to go back to that.

But I cannot fathom how some people don't realise that this is reality for many – or who actually and really believe that it's easy to job hop into vastly better pay.

At the risk of invoking Sal Paradise – what world do they inhabit?

Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Tue Sep 04, 2012 1:07 pm  

Cronus wrote:

100% tax on inheritance? Idealistic bllsht if you ask me. Why should the exchequer get a massive chunk of what parents have worked their fingers to the bone to pass on to their children? It's already been taxed - why does dying suddenly release that cash and those assets as some sort of tax bounty?

The money should be given to "good causes." If kids know they are in line for good inheitances they often become lazy and useless, despite their expensive educations. If the spongers on benefits need to work to "improve themselves" to drive the economy forward surely even more so those who have had a priveleged education. I used to work with a really nice lad whose father was a very successful businessman. As soon as the lad struggled with an exam in his mid 20s he just gave up never to work again because he couldn't see the point. He'd inherited his first tranche of money at 21 which allowed him to buy a house in an expensive area and a brand new top of the range BMW and anything else he wanted. He was in line for a few 10s of million more so he decided to watch telly (rather than Hugh Grant in About a Boy).

Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Tue Sep 04, 2012 7:48 pm  

Cronus wrote:

What about the wishes of the deceased? Many parents work hard their entire lives to provide for their children, and that includes once they have passed. They take out savings funds and even amend the legalities regarding ownership of property to ensure the maximum sum possible is passed on to their loved ones.

100% tax on inheritance? Idealistic bllsht if you ask me. Why should the exchequer get a massive chunk of what parents have worked their fingers to the bone to pass on to their children? It's already been taxed - why does dying suddenly release that cash and those assets as some sort of tax bounty?

My parents are elderly and my mum has been in poor health for many years, though you wouldn't know it to meet her. One of their biggest concerns is that what they have worked all their lives for is passed on to myself and my sister, and they've taken financial advice several times to that effect. They're not hugely wealthy but they both had decent jobs, saved and invested well and my dad fell on his feet as far as voluntary retirement was concerned.

That inheritance will help provide a better life for my family. And in the same manner, I'll do my absolute damndest to ensure my kids get as much as possible once I've gone and frankly the exchequer can go whistle. I'm not a materialistic person at all - never been bothered about a fast car or the biggest TV or latest gadgets - but I do care about the security of my family's future.

The outlook of many in this country has to completely charge in my opinion. We begrudge people who work hard to earn a lot of money for themselves yet deem it perfectly acceptable for people who have done sod all to earn that money to inherit it. How about re-focusing our tax system to encourage people to keep what they themselves have earned and to remove assets from those who haven't?

I can understand people wanting to leave a parting present for their families, perhaps to pay for a car for their grandson or a bit of cash towards their Uni fees, but I just don't see why we allow people to inherit £100,000s.

Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Tue Sep 04, 2012 7:52 pm  

Diavolo Rosso wrote:

. How about re-focusing our tax system to encourage people to keep what they themselves have earned and to remove assets from those who haven't?

Possibly because those who don't work don't tend to have any assets to remove.

Thats your first stumbling block right there.

Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Tue Sep 04, 2012 7:54 pm  

100% Inheritance Tax would be political suicide for whoever was in.

Re: "Squatters' Rights" abolished : Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:05 pm  

Horatio Yed wrote:

100% Inheritance Tax would be political suicide for whoever was in.

They'd certainly lose the farming vote.