Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 1:19 pm  

I have been trying to decide whether I should post this and also where I should post it! However, after some reflection I think it is important to post this, even if many will view this as me being negative and anti-Cas/Pro Wakefield and some will chose not to believe me at all... as after all, I can't reveal my source, just tell you that it is very reliable one!

I am posting it for two reasons, firstly I think Cas fans are being a little mis-lead by RW. I understand why he is doing this of course and if I was him and facing the licence issue and needing to present things in the best possible light I might do the same, but I do think that the fans are being possibly being deliberately mis-lead? Also, as someone who supports a 15 team SL or, if a side has to go, then it should be the failed Welsh folly, then I think the important perception that Cas are in front of Wakefield on a new stadium is unfair and now, given this news, you could say that Cas are now behind Wakefield. I don't want Cas or Wakefield to go, and what I hope this news might do is galvanise some Cas supporters into realising that losing either side is just plain wrong and unfair!

Well, here goes, I expect that another forum's members will get out their voodoo dolls and go into libel and slander overdrive...

So, a meeting has taken place between Castleford, Opus and senior planning officers at Wakefield Council, has as been widely publicized. However, this meeting was not very positive at all, in fact it was very negative and not very well received at all by the planning officers!

The long and short of is it that they perceive a retail/supermarket on Wheldon Road to have massive planning issues/implications and the proposals were seen, currently, as not being suitable for many reasons. Firstly, although this area is in the current LDF as a special regeneration zone they did not foresee any plans for major retail or a supermarket in this area at all, in fact the very opposite! Issues with increased traffic generation on the existing network and the implications for the continued re-development of both Castleford Town centre and also the established out of town retail zone at Glasshoughton.

They were, I understand, very sympathetic to Cas's situation and understood why they wanted to develop this land for this type of use, to benefit from a higher land sale value. They however were told that they have to view any application objectively and can't simply sit there and tell them everything is fine, when they have what they see as massive and legitimate planning concerns.

The meeting did end on a slightly more positive note and the planners told them that developing this land for retail was not necessarily impossible but was currently improbable, all things considered. They were happy to work closely with Opus and the club to try and present the best possible options for developing the land for an eventual application of this type on this site but, they thought that the possible section 106 implications on the developer (road and highways improvements) could be too onerous to make the development financially viable and that even then the were concerned that other planning issues, like the impact on Castleford Town Centre, might still lead them to recommending to the planning committee that they reject the application. They were also told that this was not going to be satisfactorily resolved in a short space of time and that even 12/18 months was hugely optimistic given what they had seen so far!

Finally, they did admit that the LDF may help their application longer term but as this is still a year away even if Opus just wanted to chance their arm with a planning application to the planning committee, doing so before March/April next year (when the LDF should be in force) was probably futile.

Personally, from what I have heard from my source, I do think that in the longer term prospects of getting some sort of retail of commercial use for the site may happen, but I think it is 2/3 years away before planning is granted on this site if at all!

Sorry, but this is from a very credible source, who shall of course remain confidential (sorry, I know some of you will poo-poo it just for this, but I trust them and that is the end of that) and I hope the more reasonable posters don't just shoot the messenger!

Re: Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 1:46 pm  

I had heard that the meeting didn't go how Cas wanted it to. I was told that it would possibly be five years before full planning permission would be granted on Wheldon Road as even if the council got concessions from the developers to sort out the road system, which in itself is a major stumbling block and would take years rather than months to sort, it would still be almost certain to get called in by the secretary of state. Whether their is a way around it I do not know.

Re: Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 1:53 pm  

sixtogo wrote:

I had heard that the meeting didn't go how Cas wanted it to. I was told that it would possibly be five years before full planning permission would be granted on Wheldon Road as even if the council got concessions from the developers to sort out the road system, which in itself is a major stumbling block and would take years rather than months to sort, it would still be almost certain to get called in by the secretary of state. Whether their is a way around it I do not know.

Yep, that mostly echo's what I was told, although I heard it slightly differently and the SoS call in was something that was talked about if they were determined to just simply persist and rush the application through and they would work with them over the longer term to avoid if at all possible... after all, it costs Wakefield money if it gets called in!

I also understand that Opus were quite relaxed about the whole thing, but as a developer they are in it for the long-hall and time is something they are willing to put up with if they get what they want... exactly like all developers!

Re: Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 2:07 pm  

Oh well, life goes on.

What's in it for you if Newmarket gets built or are you just backing the project so vigorously (as much if not more than the Wakey fans) out of the goodness of your heart?

I've noticed you're very supportive of Wakey as a whole on a few threads whenever they face any kind of criticism, so what's your agenda and how much dough are you in for?

Re: Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 2:14 pm  

Having read that, I just remembered why you were on the ignore list

Your source is pulling your leg, just like that source from Wakefield council who said the reserved matters application at Glasshoughton would be rejected, or the source from Wakefield council who said Newmarket would breeze through the application or the source from Wakefield council who said the whole site at Glasshoughton (Xscape & J32 included) were sinking.

A Polecat sympathising Whino, what a combo.

Re: Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 2:38 pm  

Kippaxer wrote:

Oh well, life goes on.

What's in it for you if Newmarket gets built or are you just backing the project so vigorously (as much if not more than the Wakey fans) out of the goodness of your heart?

I've noticed you're very supportive of Wakey as a whole on a few threads whenever they face any kind of criticism, so what's your agenda and how much dough are you in for?

I have posted this before, quite a few times, but will give you the benefit of the doubt and post it again.

Firstly, I live very close to Newmarket in Stanley, under a mile from the site (which is closer than anyone who lives in Methley, by a whole 1.5 miles! I am a Structural Engineer by profession and now work and specialise in quite a niche area of the timber frame industry, so by definition I am pro-development (this includes Glasshoughton & Wheldon Road) if the development is suitable. I got very angry with the first flyer sent out by the faux organisation Wakefield Community Conservation Group because (which of course is some residents of Newmarket Lane) IMO, it was full of scaremongering nonsense, half-truths and lies. How much of NIMBY hypocrite would I be if when someone wants to build on 'my doorstep' that I object, when I do believe that this is a good site!!!

At the time this first came out (about 18 months ago now maybe?) I did make a comment that not only would it be good for the area but also the company I was working for at the time (in a consultancy role, due the economic climate) who were a big steel fabricator with lots of stadium build experience, might get a look in. However, my contract was up a month later and while they wanted to extend it, I had an offer to go back into what I really love, engineered timber structures. So, when it comes to Newmarket I stand to make a big fat 0! However, a Supermarket on Wheldon Road or anywhere else (or any Supermarket from one of two majors) is a different story now!

Also, I not only do I believe in the development and the economic success it will bring to the whole of the district, the national and possibly even world community sports facilities on my own doorstep, as a father, are important to me and I believe the wider community.

I have indeed got heavily involved in Newmarket and working with it's supporters and even the club to some extent but that is because I do have some good knowledge of the process, and like showing it (who doesn't?), and as a local resident who does not have a club loyalty to Wakefield or Castleford I am, believe it or not, a bit more objective. I am not a spectator and strongly believe in active participation in this thing called life! I am ex-president of Wakefield Junior Chamber and National President of British Junior Chamber, I am a Community school governor at a local primary school (not a parent governor, my little boy is only 2) and do as much work for charity and local causes as I can... so the answer is YES, I am doing out of the goodness of my heart (other than the reason above) and struggle to see why anyone would see this as not being a good enough answer!

In answer to your question about supporting Wakefield, well yes, I have got close to many of the supporters and consider many of them, already, good friends. However, my position is always clear, I support Cas and Wakey retaining SL status and if anyone has to go then it should be Crusaders.

I have also said, if I lived in Cas I would probably have got myself involved in supporting GH and WR development (in fact, when I see the outline plans for WR, I might surprise you and also if it one of the two supermarkets I work for are interested, they could be something in it for me!) but suspect that some posters on here could imagine nothing worse!

Is that enough for now... I have some more?

Re: Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 2:41 pm  

Gronk! wrote:

Having read that, I just remembered why you were on the ignore list

Your source is pulling your leg, just like that source from Wakefield council who said the reserved matters application at Glasshoughton would be rejected, or the source from Wakefield council who said Newmarket would breeze through the application or the source from Wakefield council who said the whole site at Glasshoughton (Xscape & J32 included) were sinking.

A Polecat sympathising Whino, what a combo.

To make matters worse a Wakey sympathising Rhino who appears to have found a quasi RL topic about which he is for once able to display some knowledge - most likely acquired through local authority employment and/or a correspondence course in town planning or something else which gratifies him when his wife/mum won't let him near the stamp collection.

I'm not saying he's wrong...he's just irritating.

Re: Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 2:49 pm  

You see, Kippaxer... this is the problem.

Gronk! wrote:

Having read that, I just remembered why you were on the ignore list

Your source is pulling your leg, just like that source from Wakefield council who said the reserved matters application at Glasshoughton would be rejected, or the source from Wakefield council who said Newmarket would breeze through the application or the source from Wakefield council who said the whole site at Glasshoughton (Xscape & J32 included) were sinking.

A Polecat sympathising Whino, what a combo.

Ok, Gronk, knock yourself out mate... please go and point out where I said those things in posts - the search bottom is at the top there.

To save you the trouble of proving me right -

In fact when it came to the GH reserved matters the exact opposite is true; I did say that the outline planning application for Newmarket would breeze through and it did (you do remember it was voted through UNANIMOUSLY by the Wakefield planning committee don't you???) but of course it was always going to be referred to the SoS (it was a statutory referral) and I hoped that it would not called in - I was wrong... of well... even I am not perfect. Also, please see my sig below, a nice moment from a fellow Rhino who help me see the funny side!

As for GH sinking, people did say this, but all I said was that the site investigation was worse the anticipated and that this would impact of foundation and therefore original budget costs.

Now run along young man... the grown-ups are talking!

Re: Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 3:01 pm  

Inflatable_Armadillo wrote:

You see, Kippaxer... this is the problem.

Ok, Gronk, knock yourself out mate... please go and point out where I said those things in posts - the search bottom is at the top there.

To save you the trouble of proving me right -

In fact when it came to the GH reserved matters the exact opposite is true; I did say that the outline planning application for Newmarket would breeze through and it did (you do remember it was voted through UNANIMOUSLY by the Wakefield planning committee don't you???) but of course it was always going to be referred to the SoS (it was a statutory referral) and I hoped that it would not called in - I was wrong... of well... even I am not perfect. Also, please see my sig below, a nice moment from a fellow Rhino who help me see the funny side!

As for GH sinking, people did say this, but all I said was that the site investigation was worse the anticipated and that this would impact of foundation and therefore original budget costs.

Now run along young man... the grown-ups are talking!

Awww petal When did I say all those sources were said by you? These are just numerous occasions that trolls, yes you are a troll masquerading as someone trying to contribute.

You're the worst of the lot because you try and hide behind basic knowledge in construction and people take what you say as gospel, just like on the Wakey board and because people see right through you here you hate it and go sulking off to the mods.

Sorry, but your source is wrong. For starters, just because Opus deals in retail the build may not even involve a supermarket as of now, this is still being discussed and Wakefield Council were actually positive about the whole thing, they believe the project would be good for the town as a whole.

Back to the ignore list you go, you're boring, repetitive and tiresome.

Re: Wheldon Road - Retail Planning Application! : Thu May 19, 2011 3:07 pm  

Gronk! wrote:

Awww petal When did I say all those sources were said by you? These are just numerous occasions that trolls, yes you are a troll masquerading as someone trying to contribute.

Quick, back-track, back-track, resort to insult... and relax!!!

Gronk! wrote:

You're the worst of the lot because you try and hide behind basic knowledge in construction and people take what you say as gospel, just like on the Wakey board and because people see right through you here you hate it and go sulking off to the mods.

You are right, I got all those letters after my name by filling in and sending in a coupon off the back of a Cornflakes packet! Have you been talking to my MD?

Gronk! wrote:

Back to the ignore list you go, you're boring, repetitive and tiresome.