Re: 2 year deal for JP : Sun Mar 25, 2012 7:56 pm  

Hacked Off wrote:

Thats why I said If........

If!! do you honestly think a further two years is going to improve his game?

Re: 2 year deal for JP : Sun Mar 25, 2012 8:02 pm  

Great move.
Do the same for McGuire, Burrow, JJB and Bailey.

Now if Wire can give Briers, Monaghan, Carvell, Higham and Wood contract extensions it'll be job done

Re: 2 year deal for JP : Sun Mar 25, 2012 8:12 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

Great move.
Do the same for McGuire, Burrow, JJB and Bailey.

Now if Wire can give Briers, Monaghan, Carvell, Higham and Wood contract extensions it'll be job done

Well JJB has I think recently signed3 years I think,Burrow McGuire there ooc in 2013 now they are both still 29 so thats not too bad another two years why not ,Bailey is still only 28?and he usually gets a year at a time,but I think he may get a 2 year deal.We were getting told for much of last season the team was too old,so not too bothered really .

Re: 2 year deal for JP : Sun Mar 25, 2012 8:21 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

Great move.
Do the same for McGuire, Burrow, JJB and Bailey.

Now if Wire can give Briers, Monaghan, Carvell, Higham and Wood contract extensions it'll be job done

You mean don't give 2 year deals to the 29 year old Burrow and McGuire, the 28 year old Bailey and the 30 year old JJB? Couldn't agree more.

Re: 2 year deal for JP : Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:59 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

When have last competed with Australia when it has really mattered? Are you seriously suggesting that Kevin Sinfield is comparable to Darren Lockyer or Rob Burrow is comparable to Thurston or Roby is as good as Cameron Smith as for Billy Slater and Wellens going there would make your comments even more laughable.

A more competitive super league will only benefit the international side if the gap in quality is reduced - that is not going to happen anytime soon. So if we are to get near the Aussies the only way this will happen is if our top players mix it with the Aussies week in week out. Maybe then the gulf in quality will not be so obvious.

Id say Sinfield will do a hell of a lot more this year than Lockyer. But no, i dont think he is as good as Lockyer, strangely enough there are only two players in the entire world comparable to Lockyer in Marshall and Thurston, do i believe Sinfield is as good as those two? No, of course not, but then neither is any other halfback in the world. Is he comparable to the likes of Widdop? Foran? Soward? Hornby? Burns? Anasta? Id say so. Id take him ahead of Brett Finch who has had no problem getting NRL contracts yet has barely stood out over here.

Is Roby as good as Smith? probably not, but when both played in the same league the pretty much universal consensus was he was better than Buderus, who Wayne Bennett has just put forward (at 34) to retake the SoO shirt and he is comfortably better than the likes of Fein and De Gois. Is Tomkins as good as Slater, no probably not, but he is better than the likes of Perrett, Minichello, Wesser. Even if you dont think Hall or Briscoe the equal of Uate or Nightingale they are better than the likes of Vatuvai or Matt Utai who somehow still gets a gig, Colin Best is still a first grade player out there.

A more competitive SL is the only way the gap will ever be reduced, that doesnt happen by sending your best players elsewhere.

Re: 2 year deal for JP : Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:25 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

If!! do you honestly think a further two years is going to improve his game?

Improve...no. I am however sure that he could string a run of performances together at a higher level than witnessed tonight. Even if it is only at a slightly higher level.

Are you suggesting JP will not manage a better performance than today for the rest of the season?

Re: 2 year deal for JP : Mon Mar 26, 2012 1:33 am  

Smokey - the problem is that with the best will in the world, it's hard to see SL itself ever being as strong as the NRL. There simply isn't the money or the available talent to spread across the league.

We develop the likes of Tomkins once a decade at best. In the NRL they have at least one amazing new talent come through every year, and plenty of likely contenders in almost every position. That means that when the likes of Lockyer retire, there is someone else to take over. At the moment if Tomkins is out we're down to fullbacks who would struggle to get an NRL gig.

That's why in the short-term, a few players going to the NRL can only be a good thing - they get to play against the likes of Slater every week.

We're not going to see some mass exodus of players to the NRL. The reason is that apart from forwards, where first Morley and now Ellis have proven themselves, I suspect there is severe doubt as to the quality of SL players. A number of NRL clubs would probably be interested in Ryan Hall for example, but he's not so obviously a star that they'd throw big money at him. He'd most likely have to take a big pay cut to get an NRL contract, as even Ellis did a few years ago.

Re: 2 year deal for JP : Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:01 am  

Hacked Off wrote:

Improve...no. I am however sure that he could string a run of performances together at a higher level than witnessed tonight. Even if it is only at a slightly higher level.

Are you suggesting JP will not manage a better performance than today for the rest of the season?

No what I am saying is he is very likely to put in several worse performances than that - especially when the ground firms up and the speed of the game increases.

Re: 2 year deal for JP : Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:31 am  

SmokeyTA wrote:

Id say Sinfield will do a hell of a lot more this year than Lockyer. But no, i dont think he is as good as Lockyer, strangely enough there are only two players in the entire world comparable to Lockyer in Marshall and Thurston, do i believe Sinfield is as good as those two? No, of course not, but then neither is any other halfback in the world. Is he comparable to the likes of Widdop? Foran? Soward? Hornby? Burns? Anasta? Id say so. Id take him ahead of Brett Finch who has had no problem getting NRL contracts yet has barely stood out over here.

Is Roby as good as Smith? probably not, but when both played in the same league the pretty much universal consensus was he was better than Buderus, who Wayne Bennett has just put forward (at 34) to retake the SoO shirt and he is comfortably better than the likes of Fein and De Gois. Is Tomkins as good as Slater, no probably not, but he is better than the likes of Perrett, Minichello, Wesser. Even if you dont think Hall or Briscoe the equal of Uate or Nightingale they are better than the likes of Vatuvai or Matt Utai who somehow still gets a gig, Colin Best is still a first grade player out there.

A more competitive SL is the only way the gap will ever be reduced, that doesnt happen by sending your best players elsewhere.

You have just defeated your own argument - you said the top echelons of SL players are equal to the top echelons of NRL players - then contradicted that when quoting some examples?

Then you go and compare the very best in SL with just about the very worst in the NRL?

A more competitive SL will only come from improved coaching at all levels especially junior level - we need to increase the pool of potential players coming into game and the quality of skills of those players. This will take years - in Australia RL is a huge sport with massive revenue streams - as a result their growth will always be faster than ours, the fast track to compete at international level is to get our players playing at the NRL standard every week. They would at least get access to the best conditioning and coach expertise in the game.

Re: 2 year deal for JP : Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:51 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

You have just defeated your own argument - you said the top echelons of SL players are equal to the top echelons of NRL players - then contradicted that when quoting some examples?

Then you go and compare the very best in SL with just about the very worst in the NRL?

I havent contradicted it. You simply havent seemed to grasp what I said. I didnt say the best players in SL are the best in the world, i said the top echelons of SL are comparable to to the top echelons of the NRL. They are, they may not be the best in the world but only one player at any time is. There is no point beating ourselves up about the fact that the best players in SL arent always the best in the world. I didnt even compare them to the worst, i compared James Roby to an SoO and Australia legend, a player who has just been nominated by a coaching legend to play at what is according to the self-flagellators the highest level in RL. James Roby is a better player than him, I would say he is a better player than any NZ hooker and a better player than any Australian hooker bar Smith. Is it something we should be crying about that James Roby is only the second best hooker in the world? Not really.
Should we be upset that we arent producing a Lockyer right now? no, because Lockyer is a once in a generation player, Australia cant produce another Lockyer, Cherry-Evans wont match Lockyer and Australia havent produced a Lockyer for 20 years. The same as the Kiwis havent produced a Marshall since Marshall.

A more competitive SL will only come from improved coaching at all levels especially junior level - we need to increase the pool of potential players coming into game and the quality of skills of those players. This will take years - in Australia RL is a huge sport with massive revenue streams - as a result their growth will always be faster than ours, the fast track to compete at international level is to get our players playing at the NRL standard every week. They would at least get access to the best conditioning and coach expertise in the game.

And bringing through those players in to a league whose standard is falling because the best players in SL are shifted on to the NRL will only make the improvement needed in SL more difficult and take longer.