Re: Sam Walters : Wed May 10, 2023 3:01 pm  

It’s increasingly clear there is still no end in sight, of the issues we’ve had last few years. I’ll be wanting to see a very good team after Rohan been in charge for 3 years, as he inherited an absolute shambles and we are not that bad at least now…..

Re: Sam Walters : Wed May 10, 2023 9:13 pm  

ArthurClues wrote:

Hmmm. That's interesting maths but I'm not sure I buy it. Surely the elite are the best players in the competition, not SL players in general. When I think of elite SL players I think: Lomax, Welsby, Williams, Vaughan, French, Field etc. To put it bluntly I'm not sure anybody in that class is trotting round in blue and amber. That is something that has to change for 2023 when we'll have lots of cash to splash. I don't think you have to be an elite player to be able to run, tackle, pass to a high standard etc, but I do accept that players are human and they do make mistakes/lose form (Rhyse Martin being a good example) so we'll always be tearing our hair out to some extent. That is the nature of sport. I also accept that success is cyclical in nature, and as a supporter you have to endure the bad and average to truly enjoy the good. Not sure what difference part time v full time makes to that equation. Finally - so what if we only one three games to win the CC in 2020? They were are all SL teams and the Wigan side we beat in the semi was top notch. Nobody gave us the cup, we won it. Seems silly to pretend otherwise.

People keep mentioning Rhyse Martin been out of form this for me has coincided with him being picked at Centre he is Not a centre he's a good second row ditto Bentley playing 9&13 he's a good second row Smith has to stop tinkering.

Re: Sam Walters : Wed May 10, 2023 9:28 pm  

RAPIDO wrote:

People keep mentioning Rhyse Martin been out of form this for me has coincided with him being picked at Centre he is Not a centre he's a good second row ditto Bentley playing 9&13 he's a good second row Smith has to stop tinkering.

Martin started the season in terrible defensive form in second row tbf. Just low on form and confidence, hope he picks up…..quality player….

Re: Sam Walters : Thu May 11, 2023 1:34 pm  

ArthurClues wrote:

Hmmm. That's interesting maths but I'm not sure I buy it. Surely the elite are the best players in the competition, not SL players in general. When I think of elite SL players I think: Lomax, Welsby, Williams, Vaughan, French, Field etc. To put it bluntly I'm not sure anybody in that class is trotting round in blue and amber. That is something that has to change for 2023 when we'll have lots of cash to splash. I don't think you have to be an elite player to be able to run, tackle, pass to a high standard etc, but I do accept that players are human and they do make mistakes/lose form (Rhyse Martin being a good example) so we'll always be tearing our hair out to some extent. That is the nature of sport. I also accept that success is cyclical in nature, and as a supporter you have to endure the bad and average to truly enjoy the good. Not sure what difference part time v full time makes to that equation. Finally - so what if we only one three games to win the CC in 2020? They were are all SL teams and the Wigan side we beat in the semi was top notch. Nobody gave us the cup, we won it. Seems silly to pretend otherwise.

So SL is the elite RL competition in the northern hemisphere - by the very nature surely the players are of a standard in line with the competition? The likes of Welsby are the highest quality of the elite athletes. If you are in the top 300 golfers in the world you are an elite player. In his prime Woods would the highest quality amongst other elite players.

Part time players were working full time jobs and then playing so no real rest, training two nights a week, no real fitness regime - not sure how you compare that to full time athletes with nothing else to do but play rugby? Would you say part time players had the same opportunities to perfect their skills - really!!

I don't expect the team to win trophies - what I do expect is the team to play to its potential and execute basic skills that are practised all week in training. No team can win all the time and winning stuff is a bonus.

The pandemic created a competition that was out of the ordinary - no fans, reduced field, less games - not sure how you see that as the same value as winning it in 1999 for example?

Re: Sam Walters : Thu May 11, 2023 2:19 pm  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

So SL is the elite RL competition in the northern hemisphere - by the very nature surely the players are of a standard in line with the competition? The likes of Welsby are the highest quality of the elite athletes. If you are in the top 300 golfers in the world you are an elite player. In his prime Woods would the highest quality amongst other elite players.

Part time players were working full time jobs and then playing so no real rest, training two nights a week, no real fitness regime - not sure how you compare that to full time athletes with nothing else to do but play rugby? Would you say part time players had the same opportunities to perfect their skills - really!!

I don't expect the team to win trophies - what I do expect is the team to play to its potential and execute basic skills that are practised all week in training. No team can win all the time and winning stuff is a bonus.

The pandemic created a competition that was out of the ordinary - no fans, reduced field, less games - not sure how you see that as the same value as winning it in 1999 for example?

Nah - I just don't agree with your definition of elite when it comes to SL. Part Time v Full time - not sure what my observation on the cyclical nature of success in sport has to do with fitness. On the CC Final - 99 is probably my favourite CC win just because it took so long in coming, but that doesn't detract from the fact that we won it in 2020, and it's pointless to try and dismiss that.

Re: Sam Walters : Thu May 11, 2023 2:57 pm  

ArthurClues wrote:

Nah - I just don't agree with your definition of elite when it comes to SL. Part Time v Full time - not sure what my observation on the cyclical nature of success in sport has to do with fitness. On the CC Final - 99 is probably my favourite CC win just because it took so long in coming, but that doesn't detract from the fact that we won it in 2020, and it's pointless to try and dismiss that.

No problem - we must agree to differ on elite athletes - my view is the difference is world class and elite. You suggested the standard in the 80's 90s was shoddy - these guys were part time. These days basic skills should be a minimum full time athletes should deliver.

We must agree to disagree about 2020 - we won but a hollow victory given the nature of the competition.

Re: Sam Walters : Thu May 11, 2023 3:26 pm  

why is it hollow? only super league teams ever win it anyway and they all had the same chance as leeds did

Re: Sam Walters : Thu May 11, 2023 3:47 pm  

tad rhino wrote:

why is it hollow? only super league teams ever win it anyway and they all had the same chance as leeds did

Agree with this. If it was so easy to win, why didn't anyone else win it?

Re: Sam Walters : Thu May 11, 2023 4:20 pm  

YosemiteSam wrote:

Agree with this. If it was so easy to win, why didn't anyone else win it?

Exactly, why do some Leeds fans constantly do the club down.

Ask any of the players who won or lost for that matter werher it meant anything.

Re: Sam Walters : Thu May 11, 2023 5:02 pm  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

No problem - we must agree to differ on elite athletes - my view is the difference is world class and elite. You suggested the standard in the 80's 90s was shoddy - these guys were part time. These days basic skills should be a minimum full time athletes should deliver.

We must agree to disagree about 2020 - we won but a hollow victory given the nature of the competition.

Certainly didn't mean to decry the standards in the 80's and 90"s. Aside from the fact the Leeds were perennial bridesmaids (at best) it was something of a golden era where, for once, we were really close to the Kangaroos. The elite/world class players of the time had a profile, and perhaps talent, that todays can only dream of.