Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 12:02 am  

Printer - that comes partly from structure as well. Nobody is going to make dummy runs if they have no idea what the next play is.

You are right about the level of involvement as well though. How often do we see Aussie sides score very quickly off our mistakes for example? In SL too many teams would take two tackles to work out what to do when they get the ball. In the NRL the halfbacks are straight in trying to take advantage of a non-aligned defence. As a result the defenders also work really hard to get back into position.

To me it all goes to show that they key players are the halfbacks, and SL just doesn't produce them. I look at that Leeds side today and the biggest gulf was clearly halfback. You swap the halfback pairings around and it's not hard to imagine a Leeds win.

Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 12:04 am  

Loiner1968 wrote:

Anybody agree with what Sam Tomkins said give us back our best 10 English players playing in Australia as well as your best 10 Aussie players and we beat them.

We would certainly be a lot closer.

in fact put a full strength leeds side plus Sam Burgess against that NQC side without Thurston and we would certainly be in with a good shot.

Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 12:11 am  

ThePrinter wrote:

Thought Delaney started ok but as so often happens he seems to pick up blows and you start to see him holding a body part or struggling to make it back in line.

Hardaker it is becoming frustrating his attack, it'll become a time when you can't say he'll develop given time.

Thought Galloway went well. Keinhorst struggled but I've never thought of him as good enough to take on Aussie champs, as a good squad member in a SC SL he's fine.

Said it before, too much respect is given and you're asking for trouble if you give off that vibe. Not saying abuse the NQC but you'd think royalty had arrived this week. Make it hostile, make them uncomfortable, make them feel like no one likes them.....people would do that if Wigan or Saints came into town for a playoff so why not tonight for a WCC? Utterly bizarre and just watching the game back now and the fawning over JT and the NRL is already nauseating.....for once Phil Clarke was right, stop showing them too much respect otherwise you won't beat them.

Yep. I was looking forward to seeing these players like Thurston play too, but I left my applause until after the game. During it I was fully behind Leeds. Just like I was fully behind Saints and fully behind Wigan. And I can't stand Wigan under Shaun Wane.
I just don't understand the attitude of actively cheering on the opposition. Applaud genuine moments of outstanding skill by all means, I can remember I applauded some fantastic play from Lockyer v GB when we got hammered by the Aussies about 10 years ago. But that's because it was truly exceptional. I certainly wasn't cheering on Ali for instance when he was playing against us for the Kiwis just because he played for Leeds.

I find it a bizarre attitude and it feeds into this invincibility/God myth that we portray the Aussies as. I think it's also indicative of the backward, negative attitudes we have in other parts of the game too.

Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 12:17 am  

Him wrote:

I find it a bizarre attitude and it feeds into this invincibility/God myth that we portray the Aussies as. I think it's also indicative of the backward, negative attitudes we have in other parts of the game too.

The aussies being invincible ubermensch and the NRL being lightyears ahead means they are uncatchable and unbeatable so we shouldnt bother trying, it absolves the game in this country.

The aussies being beatable and having strengths and weaknesses means we are accountable for our failure to beat them.

Theres no blame, no questions to be asked or changes to be made it isnt our fault we can't beat superheroes. If they are fallible, if they can be beaten well......

Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 6:57 am  

SmokeyTA wrote:

Yes, Thurston is a far far better kicker than Brough, Walsh and Williams, able to kick with different spins and movements on the ball with pinpoint accuracy.

But this flies in the face of what actually happened though - his kicks weren't particularly good

Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 8:07 am  

As a Saints fan I'd just like to say well done to Leeds - you give it a real go in the first half and caused genuine trouble for the so called unbeatable Aussies with your brand and offloading.
It was good to hear B McD pre game say if we go set for set we'll lose. I only wish our own coach could see further than boring set for set RL.
Also I think injuries for all 3 SL sides has been very unfortunate. Us our best 2 players in Roby/ Perci . Wigan with both Tomkins' then McIllorum and you guys with your several missing. Whilst I don't think these players would change the overall result - it would be closer than the 30 point spankings we all received.

Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 8:30 am  

Him wrote:

Thought Sutcliffe looked a bit lost/unsure in the 2nd half and that was the point I reckon where either Sinfield or McGuire would've stepped up and eased the pressure on him. Sadly I think McGuire getting injured was the worst possible thing to happen for us. The likes of Sutcliffe and Lilley just need that bit of direction/leadership at times and when it's missing they aren't developed enough yet to fill that leadership gap/to know what to do next.

I thought last season that Sutcliffe showed signs of real quality, but I've yet to see anything from Lilley other than lots of effort. When you compare them (& Wigan & Saints experienced halves) to the rookie Aussie halves we are miles behind in that area.

Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 9:11 am  

Loiner1968 wrote:

Anybody agree with what Sam Tomkins said give us back our best 10 English players playing in Australia as well as your best 10 Aussie players and we beat them.

Are there 10 English ex SL players currently playing in the NRL?

I can think of 6 obvious ones.

Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 9:17 am  

Seth wrote:

I've just been out this morning coaching my U16s and as our team were arriving and I was setting up I watched yet another group of u7/8s queue in a line of 18 waiting to run the ball into 2 'coaches' holding tackle shields. This poor practice is unfortunately common throughout most clubs.

I took my current team on as u9/u10s they were in group/division 4 and were the 'B' team at the club in our age group. I went into coaching 13 years ago (this is my second team) in order to develop my career and to develop players In the right way at the right age group. My knowledge and expertise allowed me to see what the long game should be about, to develop sustainable core principles, skills and of course the enjoyment of the game without the concern of winning and losing, as a product of these methods we have climbed the divisions and are in the premier. Some parents took convincing but my role as coach was to deliver the right messages to the players so that win or lose they could see why we were doing things the way we were (...and of course having fun). Unfortunately at a crucial age our children on the whole are being coached in the way I referred to at the start of this post, and therefore our talent pool at the top of the game is largely reliant on the natural (yet still restricted) ability of a relatively small number of players.

What a top post this is!
If only we could get the majority of young coaches to adopt the same approach and philosophy, we might give ourselves a chance of matching the best and deepen the number of clubs who could compete.

Re: WCC : Mon Feb 22, 2016 9:19 am  

son of headingley wrote:

But this flies in the face of what actually happened though - his kicks weren't particularly good

And yet they scored directly off two of them and we spilled another.