Re: Have Leeds lost hunger, as a club? : Sun Sep 17, 2023 12:45 pm  

There is a simple solution, it’s just not a quick one. Both GH and RS need to move on, GH to purely the non rugby side, and RS out of the club altogether.

I don’t see us back seriously challenging for another 2-3 years yet.

Re: Have Leeds lost hunger, as a club? : Sun Sep 17, 2023 1:54 pm  

batleyrhino wrote:

There is a simple solution, it’s just not a quick one. Both GH and RS need to move on, GH to purely the non rugby side, and RS out of the club altogether.

I don’t see us back seriously challenging for another 2-3 years yet.

2-3 years ago people were saying exactly the same, so maybe make that another 4-6.

Re: A lot of kids out there : Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:26 pm  

KaeruJim wrote:

I think RS has been coaching for nearly 20 years including behind the scenes roles at NRL clubs. The fact that he is attempting to replace the entire spine at Leeds which he inherited tells you where he’s not happy with the squad.

I agree that structure has been missing this season all too often but either Austin and Sezer have failed to provide it or we’ve been running without recognised halves. Individual errors from players have also denied us much structure because we’ve been constantly on the back foot/losing the energy battle.

Our D has actually been pretty good all year other than the last 2 games, which coincides with just too many players gone or out of position.

We are all frustrated but the side will be totally different next year and we’re going to have to wait to see what RS pulls out with a new spine and other key players in place.

Im not talking about next year though Jim, im talking about this season, from pre-season to now, Smith's had a shocker, even regular fans with a basic knowledge base could see pre-season was a shambles as it was happening, they were right

And that tradjectory has been maintained throughout the season, he's largely to blame for the lack of cohesion with his 'why slot in one player when i can move 3' approach to someone being unavailable.

A structure should be implemented regardless of personel, you will get different levels of fit depending on players abilitys, but a structure should still be visable, these arnt u8's we're talking about, for all the talk of a young side, o'conner aside, we've had the oldest spine in the comp, but our only visable pattern of attacking play was still throw the ball about and hope for the best, a coach should be able to get more from experienced halfs/fullback, wether they are his ideal spine or not. Now they arnt available we'r seeing the cost of the lack of structure, because players with less talent/expierience are now in that position of having to conjure something out of nothing, and they cant do it.

Now im not suggesting he cant turn it around, or that he wasnt a breath of fresh air last year, but talking about his performance this season in isolation, he's had a shocker, no two ways about it

Re: A lot of kids out there : Sun Sep 17, 2023 2:54 pm  

KaeruJim wrote:

Hooley, Olpherts (who was directly responsible for errors leading to their first three tries IMO), Ruan, Sinfield, Donaldson are all reserve/back up players. That’s 5/17.

In addition we have a back rower at 6 and a winger in the centre.

Most of the players didn’t lack effort. The team is busted and falls apart under pressure in the circumstances.

Oledski was the player running back to try to take their winger into touch for that first try. McDonnell and Holroyd always give 100%. Smith tried hard too.

It does annoy me when people make broad brush statements like players are all 3/10 when we lose and 9/10 when we win. It’s just rubbish. Of course we should have performed better last 2 games but some of you would sack Hetherington, JJB, all the players, all the coaching staff and Betty the tea lady.

If Betty did the team talk next week we would probably get a better response from the players. Rohan is a joker.

Re: Have Leeds lost hunger, as a club? : Sun Sep 17, 2023 3:51 pm  

batleyrhino wrote:

There is a simple solution, it’s just not a quick one. Both GH and RS need to move on, GH to purely the non rugby side, and RS out of the club altogether.

I don’t see us back seriously challenging for another 2-3 years yet.

Let's say that happens starting tomorrow. 12-18 months in, fans will be saying exactly the same thing with the new CEO and coach. What do we do then, stick or twist?

Re: Have Leeds lost hunger, as a club? : Sun Sep 17, 2023 3:58 pm  

Exeter Rhino wrote:

Let's say that happens starting tomorrow. 12-18 months in, fans will be saying exactly the same thing with the new CEO and coach. What do we do then, stick or twist?

Wouldn’t that depend on how we were doing and what plan we had communicated?

Re: A lot of kids out there : Sun Sep 17, 2023 8:52 pm  

KaeruJim wrote:

Hooley, Olpherts (who was directly responsible for errors leading to their first three tries IMO), Ruan, Sinfield, Donaldson are all reserve/back up players. That’s 5/17.

In addition we have a back rower at 6 and a winger in the centre.

Most of the players didn’t lack effort. The team is busted and falls apart under pressure in the circumstances.

Oledski was the player running back to try to take their winger into touch for that first try. McDonnell and Holroyd always give 100%. Smith tried hard too.

It does annoy me when people make broad brush statements like players are all 3/10 when we lose and 9/10 when we win. It’s just rubbish. Of course we should have performed better last 2 games but some of you would sack Hetherington, JJB, all the players, all the coaching staff and Betty the tea lady.

Definitely wouldn't sack Betty the tea lady as a good cup of tea is probably the only potential pleasure at Headingley currently. I have always tried to he balanced about it and you cannot change every role at once in an organisation however clearly as a club we have issues at all levels and many where there before RS was appointed.
The last 2 games are just the culmination of issues that have either been there for a number of years at board and organisation level or that have steadily got worse at coaching and playing level all year.
I thought RS did well last year but this year has been a creeping disaster and I fear he is probably not the right man now however it's very hard to change at this stage although personally I would try and get Sean Wane.
The key worries regarding RS this year for me are as follows.

Coaching team according to Gary the coach picks them Walker and Grix not for me!
No proper pre-season and team seemed underprepared.
Experimenting with players out of position.
Passive Defense
Lack of clear attacking structure.
Poor communication and no leaders on the pitch possibly recruitment issue but Smith is passive as well.
Dealing with poor discipline. (Newman)
Appears to have lost the dressing room.

Now it's not all RS fault as I think Gary has thrown him under the bus a bit but if he picks the coaches and is in charge of recruitment and who stays and go's then somebody needs to stand up and take some responsibility

Re: A lot of kids out there : Sun Sep 17, 2023 9:04 pm  

Salary cap not available on the night is huge, and includes arguably our first choice spine at the start of the season. Different reasons why some of these players aren't available but arguably only Leeming could have been replaced in-season.

Tetevano - marquee signing
Sezer - marquee or close to marquee money
Walters - our 'best young player' according to Wilkin
Myler - injured
Bentley - injured
Sangare - injured
Austin - left during season and not replaced
Leeming - left during season and not replaced
Macdonald - left during season and not replaced

Re: A lot of kids out there : Sun Sep 17, 2023 9:07 pm  

How many games would Leeds have won in 2015 without Hardaker, McGuire, Sinfield and Aiton/Burrow all out, plus Peacock (as our highest paid forward, equivalent to Tetevano).

Re: Have Leeds lost hunger, as a club? : Sun Sep 17, 2023 9:28 pm  

Seth wrote:

2-3 years ago people were saying exactly the same, so maybe make that another 4-6.

Exactly Seth….it’s like Groudhog day