Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 6:36 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

Are you seriously suggesting out of all the potential business men out there GH is simply the best? you are aren't you!!!

Take away the sugar daddy from Leeds and it would not be where it is now - it is easier to run a business when you have no real money worries - you can make mistakes and they are not catastrophic. I am not suggesting Hetherington has not done a great job in the past, but that is not now and what I see now is a shambles of a RU club, a RL side with falling attendances and a team that are unable to compete with the better sides in the comp, playing at a ground that is 3/4s derelict. Maybe my idea of a business doing well is not the same as yours.

I dont think there would be a shortage of potential buyers if leeds rlwas put up for sale now,back then it looked as though we were going to Elland road like paupers,while the newly formed ruclub was going to take our stadium

Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 6:47 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

the fact we have so many players OOC at the same time is poor management.

Whilst not agreeing with everything posted thus far, i think that Sal is quite right regarding having so many players OOC and all at the same time

Ideally a successful club like ours would have no more than a 3 player turn around in the first team squad from outside our junior club structures each season

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but a few subtle changes to our 2009 GF winning side could have possibly taken us close to a 4th GF win and even a CC final win could it not?

Time will only tell as to how well GH has planned these squad issues come this seasons end

Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 7:03 pm  

G1 wrote:

Interesting analogy.

In terms of now did you see the last set of accounts filed by Leeds CF&A ltd?

I think they're a huge pat on the back for GH (and they have nothing to do with 2004) and put us at the forefront of every RL club in this country.

I don't just admire GH for what he did in 2004 (or any of the title winning season's for that matter). I admire him, in particular, for where he has taken the club from 1997 to where it is now. That has diddly squat to do with on field results or the odd poor coach appointed to the 1st team.

The last set of accounts show turnover of 11.1m and a loss of of 84k - not sure if that represents quality management or not?

Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 8:37 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

The last set of accounts show turnover of 11.1m and a loss of of 84k - not sure if that represents quality management or not?

The accounts include a one off provision for the image rights case of by my estimate £500k+. Add that back and you've got a better basis on which to assess the Rhinos' financial performance.

Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 8:52 pm  

MjM wrote:

The accounts include a one off provision for the image rights case of by my estimate £500k+. Add that back and you've got a better basis on which to assess the Rhinos' financial performance.

So for 11m they have a profit of 200-300k hardly stunning is it for the guru of sports club management!!

So all that says is profits have been overstated in previous years?

Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:04 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

So for 11m they have a profit of 200-300k hardly stunning is it for the guru of sports club management!!

So all that says is profits have been overstated in previous years?

It depends on whether you understand the Leeds business or not. Caddick is happy for it to break even in the long run. The more money made, the more can be reinvested into community projects or stadium improvements with a bit put aside perhaps to cross-subsidise the RU club. But with such different motivations behind the business is foolish to try and view RL or Leeds CF&A like any normal company. The growth in the business in terms of turnover is perhaps more interesting - although most accoutants would advise against that as a starting point for measuring business success it is a decent indication of how things have developed under his management.

As far as RL administrators go Hetherington has achieved more in his career than the rest of the Super League bosses put together so I would suggest he is better placed to manage the current period of "transition" than anyone else.

Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:15 pm  

MjM wrote:

It depends on whether you understand the Leeds business or not. Caddick is happy for it to break even in the long run. The more money made, the more can be reinvested into community projects or stadium improvements with a bit put aside perhaps to cross-subsidise the RU club. But with such different motivations behind the business is foolish to try and view RL or Leeds CF&A like any normal company.

As far as RL administrators go Hetherington has achieved more in his career than the rest of the Super League bosses put together so I would suggest he is better placed to manage the current period of "transition" than anyone else.

I have downloaded the accounts nothing in the notes to suggest a provision of such a material size - could be I have had too many glasses of wine. Are you suggesting the increase in accruals is is the other side of the transactions?

Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:19 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

I have downloaded the accounts nothing in the notes to suggest a provision of such a material size - could be I have had too many glasses of wine. Are you suggesting the increase in accruals is is the other side of the transactions?

It involves a bit of deduction and being told where to look

Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:21 pm  

MjM wrote:

It depends on whether you understand the Leeds business or not. Caddick is happy for it to break even in the long run. The more money made, the more can be reinvested into community projects or stadium improvements with a bit put aside perhaps to cross-subsidise the RU club. But with such different motivations behind the business is foolish to try and view RL or Leeds CF&A like any normal company. The growth in the business in terms of turnover is perhaps more interesting - although most accoutants would advise against that as a starting point for measuring business success it is a decent indication of how things have developed under his management.

As far as RL administrators go Hetherington has achieved more in his career than the rest of the Super League bosses put together so I would suggest he is better placed to manage the current period of "transition" than anyone else.

as I said before it is easier to manage a business when cash flow isn't a major concern - I would suggest the issues around the development of the Southstand give an interesting view as to what the real issues are. Whilst you think this is just Hetherington postulating with the council I think this is a lack of cash - perhaps greater profitability would have enabled greater investment in a potentially lucrative revenue stream?

Re: Cross & Burgess... Get us out of here : Fri Jun 17, 2011 9:24 pm  

MjM wrote:

It involves a bit of deduction and being told where to look

The balance sheet can only be two lines Other creditors or Accruals both have moved significantly as have the wages?

137k not a bad salary for such a small firm