Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 7:07 am  

When it was revealed that the reason for the late publication of Shield fixtures was the Swinton winding up petition, I went to The Gazette only to find that HMRC have since September last year issued 5 winding up petitions against Swinton, all eventually dismissed.

So, question to my learned colleagues, why have Swinton not been deducted 6 points???? I can understand it for one, maybe two petitions, but 5? And a good argument for the company trading insolvently, which it is not supposed to do in company law and in RFL rules.

One issue is the lack of detail as to why the petitions were dismissed, which could shed some light on matters.

Re: Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 7:11 am  

The reason will be because they have settled there winding up petition, if they hadn't they would of been put in admin and then been given a point deduction.

I think!!!!!

[Bullseye]

Re: Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 7:16 am  

I think that's right Ricky.

Re: Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 7:37 am  

Don't like to see threads like these, people clamouring for other teams to be deducted league points etc.
Hopefully Swinton can get their finances sorted out and don't end up in a position similar to the ones we've found ourselves in too many times over the last few seasons. I suspect selling Atkin to Hull KR has given them the cash boost they needed.

Besides, Swinton could go bust and be deducted an infinite number of league points - it still wouldn't change anything with regards to relegation so who cares?

Re: Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 8:05 am  

If they get a winding up order dismissed, they've done nothing wrong as far as the competition goes. We got deducted points for going into admin, not for having Winding Up Orders/Petitions against us. Jesus, if we'd have been deducted for every one of those too, we'd be on about -106 points now.

Re: Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 12:28 pm  

The question is about 5 yes FIVE winding up petitions since September 2016, one every two months average, so thanks for the comments so far, but none address the question.

Correction: 6 yes SIX winding up petitions. Dates:
19th August 16
18th October 16
19th December 16
22nd February 17
3rd May 17
7th July 17

These are all dismissed, not deferred or postponed, so as far as I can see are not the one petition presented six times, but six separate ones. Or can anybody advise differently, that its one and the same insolvency event, and therefore fully understandable.

Re: Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 1:02 pm  

It will be interesting to see if they get last years accounts to CH in time, due at the end of this month. The Confirmation Statement (annual return to most of us) appears to have been late as there was a striking off notice from CH in The Gazette followed quickly by receipt of the CS. That's in March this year.

looking at the previous figures for 2014 and 2015, they lose money every year which is offset by share issues, but no issues in 2016/17 hence this years would be interesting to see. However, Intangible Assets (my alternative name for this balance sheet line is The Biggest Opportunity for Window Dressing your Accounts) have increased each year, keeping the balance sheet positive rather than negative (negative would mean that their losses exceed share capital).

Any body got any idea as to what Intangible Assets the Swinton Lions could have that are worth £100,000 at cost, possibly more when we get 2016 accounts let alone 2017? You would think there was something, with Alan Marshall being an accountant and the Trust's representative on the board of directors, wouldn't you?

Re: Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:42 pm  

martinwildbull wrote:

The question is about 5 yes FIVE winding up petitions since September 2016, one every two months average, so thanks for the comments so far, but none address the question.

Correction: 6 yes SIX winding up petitions. Dates:
19th August 16
18th October 16
19th December 16
22nd February 17
3rd May 17
7th July 17

These are all dismissed, not deferred or postponed, so as far as I can see are not the one petition presented six times, but six separate ones. Or can anybody advise differently, that its one and the same insolvency event, and therefore fully understandable.

What is this 'insolvency event' you are referring to?
HMRC will issue a winding up order every time a payment is late. If all of these petitions were dismissed, then that probably means that the liabilities were eventually paid.

The reason ours went a step (or several steps) further is because there was no way in the world we were ever going to have the funds to pay HMRC, or any of our other creditors for that matter. Green deferred it as long as he could, until he knew the game was up.

Re: Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 4:37 pm  

See some sad stuff on here over the last few years but for a Bulls fan to clutch at such low straws is the worst. When any club get's in difficulty it's sad and if they get winding up orders and sort them we should celebrate that.

It's almost like a final reminder on a household bill martinwildbull there is no limit to the number you get as long as they are paid. Bull couldn't so RFL had to punish you. Sad truth and I think in every case the previous owners didn't get a "Clean" set of accurate accounts and massively underestimated the investment required and ran out of investable capital so just couldn't find the money to fight winding up orders.

In a way the only logic I can see this year from an outside point of view is that the owners are trying to baseline the running cost so the can create a working model to take you forward.

Must as the fans are hurt the owners could have been brought in a few players to get a few more wins, so again all I can see is them trying to limit losses so with full RL money and no points deduction they can start moving upward once more.

Re: Swinton points deduction? : Tue Aug 01, 2017 4:59 pm  

Nothus wrote:

Don't like to see threads like these, people clamouring for other teams to be deducted league points etc.
Hopefully Swinton can get their finances sorted out and don't end up in a position similar to the ones we've found ourselves in too many times over the last few seasons. I suspect selling Atkin to Hull KR has given them the cash boost they needed.

Besides, Swinton could go bust and be deducted an infinite number of league points - it still wouldn't change anything with regards to relegation so who cares?

I think if they did go tits then it would likely mean one less team being relegated as otherwise the numbers wouldn't add up.

Hopefully Swinton somehow manage to sort it out. I wouldn't wish any of what we've had on my worst enemy and above all you feel sorry for the fans.