Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 8:08 am  

Our game management problem continues. This has been an issue for years. The only constant in that time is Lilley. We’ve changed fullback several times, hooker several times, the pack has turned over personnel and Lilley has had a lot of different half back partners. Is Gaskell the short term answer? Who has Lilley worked well with in all his time here? Brough was probably the best but he was on one leg most of the time. Ott hasn’t worked in the halves, is fine at hooker. Davies worked ok twice but probably through shock value. Jowitt hasn’t worked. Holmes was ok but he’s a better FB.

Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 8:19 am  

Re Flanagan, some think if you clap your hands t the ruck it brings speed and enthusiasm. Unfortunately for Flanagan he has a lot of haste but not much speed. He was like an oil tanker trying to slide across the defensive line in the early season games. There's a huge difference between Championship and L1.

[Bullseye]

Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 8:24 am  

Think the main issue with this team is a lack of leadership and rugby brain in the playmaking positions. That's been an issue off and on for ages. When Gaskell, Lawrence and Smith are out we're completely rudderless.

Against Batley we clearly followed the gameplan for about 15-20 mins and the rest of the time did our own thing. It was infuriating to see the side utterly ignore the fundamentals of trying to go forward and instead chuck aimless passes wide to players stood still. The main culprits were the halfbacks.

I like Lilley at hooker but he's not the organising halfback we need. He's not a leader, never has been, nor is he quick enough. As for Ott he looked lost. Clearly he's not up to calling the shots, at least not yet and he's also too slow for halfback. Holmes is a runner. Jowitt is a runner too. Gaskell is very injury prone. Davies is probably the least worst option until Gaskell comes back.

The sort of rugby we played against Batley belied any kind of rugby brains at all. When we did the basics we looked miles better. Fulton looked unstoppable off the back of the go forward we got in the pack. After 20 mins I don't think he got another decent pass for the rest of the game. For some reason, and EOC said he's find out the answer, we changed to play short-cut rugby. We can speculate on why that was the case - I believe that some players are lacking the mental aptitude required and don't have the ability or confidence to take charge.

[Bullseye]

Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 8:43 am  

Bull Mania wrote:

Re Flanagan, some think if you clap your hands t the ruck it brings speed and enthusiasm. Unfortunately for Flanagan he has a lot of haste but not much speed. He was like an oil tanker trying to slide across the defensive line in the early season games. There's a huge difference between Championship and L1.

Agreed. He’s 38 FFS. Even in his prime he wasn’t a top-level championship player. The occasionally barge over try and some think he’s Ben Elias. As dummy half you need to pick your moment and George overplays that hand. He’s no kicking game and his passing is all over the place now. The contrast between Flanagan’s passing and Souter’s is incredible. Souter’s passes are quick and accurate, Flanagan’s can end up anywhere and used to cost valuable time as the first receiver had to adjust. I could go on. He may be a great lad off the field but that’s it.

Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 9:07 am  

From what i've heard, EoC has his work cut out with some of this squad and its starting to show in some of the decisions he has/is making. That includes Flanagan going to on loan and Blackmore being released.

EoC hasn't left France to come and coach a side in the Championship... he wants to be coaching at the highest level. However he faces a clear split in the camp.

On one half you have aspirational players who want to work their way into SL. On the other half you have a group of seasoned Championship players who would either struggle to take the step up (either through age or ability) or simply don't want to (i.e. they have good solid careers away from rugby and being full time professionals would not work for them financially).

I've been told more than once that the way the team train is much more suited to a full time environment. Tougher, higher intensity training (especially after a full days work) is being blamed by some players as a cause for the lengthy injury list, whilst others just aren't enjoying it as much and think the fun is being taken out of sessions. And this apparently is causing friction.

If that is true, I'd expect to see quite a few leaving the squad over the next couple of months, with a major overhaul coming in for 2025. I cannot see EoC changing his philosophy and the club have backed themselves into a corner with his long contract so they cannot do anything other than to back him.

Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 9:31 am  

Well if that's the case I'd back EOC everytime. We can't complain about players not having the right attitude for the lesser teams if they have that attitude for training.

[Bullseye]

Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 9:33 am  

If that's the case then we're in for an interesting ride.

EOC's approach may work but it relies on us keeping those aspirational players and not having them picked off by SL teams. Okoro is one we've already lost this year and I can see Doro going the same way. How will the club keep these players and build a decent squad while they don't have a reasonable chance of getting into SL due to the state of the ground? Do the club think they're genuinely in with a shout of getting SL status? Or are we going to rely on really good recruitment and coaching and manage the inevitable departure of our better players?

Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 10:30 am  

bullinenemyland wrote:

From what i've heard, EoC has his work cut out with some of this squad and its starting to show in some of the decisions he has/is making. That includes Flanagan going to on loan and Blackmore being released.

EoC hasn't left France to come and coach a side in the Championship... he wants to be coaching at the highest level. However he faces a clear split in the camp.

On one half you have aspirational players who want to work their way into SL. On the other half you have a group of seasoned Championship players who would either struggle to take the step up (either through age or ability) or simply don't want to (i.e. they have good solid careers away from rugby and being full time professionals would not work for them financially).

I've been told more than once that the way the team train is much more suited to a full time environment. Tougher, higher intensity training (especially after a full days work) is being blamed by some players as a cause for the lengthy injury list, whilst others just aren't enjoying it as much and think the fun is being taken out of sessions. And this apparently is causing friction.

If that is true, I'd expect to see quite a few leaving the squad over the next couple of months, with a major overhaul coming in for 2025. I cannot see EoC changing his philosophy and the club have backed themselves into a corner with his long contract so they cannot do anything other than to back him.

I think this was part of Featherstone’s problem the last couple of years. They definitely had the best senior part time players in the comp, who knew they still had 2 or 3 years in the championship being the best but had zero interest in giving up good jobs to go to SL

[Bullseye]

Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 10:59 am  

It was also our problem in 2015 and 2016 before we went part time.

We'd regularly come up against part time teams that contained part timers that were on their day better than what we had as fulltime

Unless recruitment is really smart this is what we could risk again.

I'm still not sure how you sell this to prospective players and how you keep anyone who gets genuine interest from a SL team.

For me you're either full time or part time.

Re: Batley (A) : Tue May 28, 2024 6:04 pm  

I’ve heard similar to BIEL above although I don’t have sources that I’m sure they have but rumours of fall outs are matching up. Certain players blaming EOC / EOC deciding a player wouldn’t be at the club if he was here when contracts were sorted last year. All makes for interesting watching but we know something has to give because this valiant display against decent sides and undercooked showings vs everyone else is dull for the fans who keep dropping away.

The club need to back EOC. We’ve got no chance until we go back to full time whatever it takes. Unless we decide to forget all about it and stop setting these targets of promotion