Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 3:55 pm  

Must admit I thought Deacon was younger than that. IIRC he was a teenager when he came here so I take back my statement about him almost fully formed when he came here.

(Cue Tigertot)

Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 4:00 pm  

vbfg wrote:

Must admit I thought Deacon was younger than that. IIRC he was a teenager when he came here so I take back my statement about him almost fully formed when he came here.

(Cue Tigertot)

Or one of the Georgesons

Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 4:12 pm  

I might be knocking on a bit but my lips is still young innit.

Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 4:17 pm  

vbfg wrote:

When was the last time we brought a half back of any kind through? Hookers, yeah. Forwards by the bucket load. I don't recall the last time an academy product got the chance at six or seven. Was it Leon? Who left for lack of opportunity...

Who was that Australian Scrum Half we signed? Oh that was him " Matt Orford" and we know how that one worked out don't we? We've signed plenty over recent years and most of them are playing for rival Teams. We don't have a good record with Scrum Halves over recent years.

[Bullseye]

Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 5:26 pm  

Deacs was 19 when he debuted in 1998 and IMO he became a fully fledged 1st team regular in 2002.

So he was 23 and Long was 24. It shows the insanity of having to make your mind up about players at 19.

Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 6:00 pm  

Unfortunately coaches seem obsessed with playing back-rowers at HB rather than a young actual HB. Lowes with Addy & Purtell instead of giving young Adam Brook. Cunningham choosing Wilkin/Turner instead of Fages. They're scared of Young HBs making mistakes and decide to go with a first team player who has no creativity. But hey he can defend. Then said coach says in his post match interview the team didn't create anything and we were sloppy in attack.

Why we didn't give Brook a go last year beggars belief. We had a perfect opportunity to let him develop and make mistake. He was a real gem in our 19s and looked to have plenty of potential. But nah Purtell and Addy are the solution!

[Bullseye]

Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 6:24 pm  

Times have changed a lot in terms of physical conditioning. In the 80s and 90s halfbacks usually weighed around 12-13st. Shaun Edwards was 11st! Forwards were rarely over 16st and very rarely over 17st.

The smaller bloke wasn't at such a great strength advantage and wasn't such a defensive weakness.

Nowadays the difference is much greater. The little Halfback is targeted by 17st runners. Backs are built like forwards were. He has to be able to defend.

Most smaller lads don't finish growing until their early 20s. It's no surprise that halfbacks aren't coming through at 19 years of age.

They're rarely physically mature enough to cope with 1st team rugby. Attacking wise they may be ready in some respects but defensively they're not. You have a duty of care to these lads.

Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 8:06 pm  

You could see with southernwood how slight he was. He played at Cas and they just charged at him everytime they got the ball. To be fair to the lad I thought he handled himself well considering the size of the men that were charging him.

Somebody like Southernwood would be ideal. Had chance to physically mature and used to a tough division.

Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 9:42 pm  

Bull Mania wrote:

Unfortunately coaches seem obsessed with playing back-rowers at HB rather than a young actual HB. Lowes with Addy & Purtell instead of giving young Adam Brook. Cunningham choosing Wilkin/Turner instead of Fages. They're scared of Young HBs making mistakes and decide to go with a first team player who has no creativity. But hey he can defend. Then said coach says in his post match interview the team didn't create anything and we were sloppy in attack.

Why we didn't give Brook a go last year beggars belief. We had a perfect opportunity to let him develop and make mistake. He was a real gem in our 19s and looked to have plenty of potential. But nah Purtell and Addy are the solution!

After the club and Bullbuilder supported him since he signed for the club in 2011.
The way he was ruthlessly binned by Jimmy Lowes cuts deep amongst a lot of supporters.

Those games last year against Workington and Whitehaven is when we should have given him a go at scrum half.

Re: Where do we go from here? Two weeks off! : Mon Apr 11, 2016 10:06 pm  

Bullseye wrote:

Times have changed a lot in terms of physical conditioning. In the 80s and 90s halfbacks usually weighed around 12-13st. Shaun Edwards was 11st! Forwards were rarely over 16st and very rarely over 17st.

The smaller bloke wasn't at such a great strength advantage and wasn't such a defensive weakness.

Nowadays the difference is much greater. The little Halfback is targeted by 17st runners. Backs are built like forwards were. He has to be able to defend.

Most smaller lads don't finish growing until their early 20s. It's no surprise that halfbacks aren't coming through at 19 years of age.

They're rarely physically mature enough to cope with 1st team rugby. Attacking wise they may be ready in some respects but defensively they're not. You have a duty of care to these lads.

I do agree Bullseye but on the other side of the coin, Sam Tomkins particularly in the first couple of years didn't look anything like a rugby player physically. I think we're still waiting for Rob Burrow to be physically ready for full time rugby

Yes HBs they need to defend, but at the same time most of our team should be dropped based on their defending in recent weeks.

I want my HB to be able to kick, pass, organise and put a team mate through a gap. Danny Addy and Gaskell both miss plenty of tackles. But Addy can't really do any of what I just mentioned consistently.

Brooks been playing for Keighley in league 1 regularly so to have given him a few games against Hunslet and Workington when we absolutely dominated wouldn't have done him any harm.

It's the fact we didn't even give him a chance that annoys me when being in the championship was the perfect opportunity to do so. we found ourselves in a situation with a loose forward and centre as our HB partnership for a lot of last year and no number 7 for all of this year. It's bonkers.

The young lads we've given debuts this year have all held their own. Im sure Adam Brook would have been ok with him and Gaskell at 6&7 while we could still have been on the look out for a more experienced HB if needed and one became available. At the moment we've no one and might not get one as no one might be available.