Re: carvell : Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:24 pm  

Mirfieldbull wrote:

So on basis Carvell is almost certain to go, what about Evans and Mason as replacements, should be able to get for same money paying Carvell and adds depth to the squad. Not ideal, but at this stage, take what's available and we need numbers and size!

agreed, given our luck two props are better than one.

Re: carvell : Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:16 am  

Mirfieldbull wrote:

TUPE is transfer of contracts when an organization takes on the work previously carried out by another company, so protecting employees from losing their jobs when organizations take on work previously carried out by another. The argument is Carvell's contract TUPE transferred to new owners from OK Bulls. As an employee, Carvell had the right to refuse the TUPE transfer but needed to do it on day 1. If he did that he was free to look for employment elsewhere. This is exactly what Kopczak did. By the fact this case is still rumbling on 1 week later, my guess is that Carvell and his advisers didn't cover their backsides properly.

Thanks

Re: carvell : Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:32 am  

So... Gareth Carvell must have been happy on the day we Tuped him over to the newco, otherwise there wouldn't have been an issue with him leaving.

His agent has then come in after the 1 day deadline (i think this is the case), and said to GC "Hull are interested, and i can get you more money and better security, but it may drag out a little as we are a little bit late in refusing the tupe" GC agrees to this, yet we have already registered him with the RFL.

GC then does a Peter Odemwingi, and drives over to Hull himself, hoping to force the issue.

The Hull paper says he's about to sign for them.

RHP and the Bulls then publicly state that GC is contracted to the Bulls and refuse to just let him leave for free.

It is then announced that GC is having a fitness test at Hull, but Lee Radford comes out and says GC and the Bulls situation is complicated, and Luke Gale is no longer a target.

I think there are 3 options to resolve this sorry saga.

1 - GC says sorry and resumes the deal with us (Bradford).

2 - Hull pay us for his registration,( amount we have paid in wages and expenses since his deal began).

3 - RFL will rule GC is a free agent and can sign for Hull for free.

My guess is option 2.

Re: carvell : Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:37 am  

I think the RFL have said they get are not getting involved I could be wrong though.

Option 4 - Garreth Carvell and his team threaten legal action. Bulls can't afford the matter or don't want to go down that route. Bulls agree release of Carvell from contract and he joins Hull.

Re: carvell : Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:55 am  

some actual quotes from the carvell saga Radford on gc; "There are a lot of issues with the RFL and the Bulls and we’ll have to see how that one stands, but at the minute he is a registered Bradford player. “If things change then my opinion will change on that.” RHP on gc Bulls chief executive Robbie Hunter-Paul said: “Garreth Carvell is contracted to the Bradford Bulls and that contract is registered with the RFL. He’s still a member of our staff.” Hunter-Paul said there had been no contact from Hull yesterday but the Bulls had held dialogue with the player’s agent Andy Clarke. The New Zealander added: “We are exploring all options.” On Gale; Former Bulls forward Radford said: “When Bradford’s issues surfaced we made a play for Luke and were told categorically he was not for sale. “I don’t know if anything has changed but we have a salary cap On Gale, Hunter-Paul added: “Luke Gale is a key member of the Bradford Bulls team and we have big plans for his future here.” ....so, both bradford and hull publically accept that both Gale and Carvell are contracted Bradford players. The dialogue will be about the amount of compensation for carvell as gareth has clearly launched his teddy out of the pram and as Jammie said had done an odemwingie. It looks to me like he probably never really wanted to play for us anyway, I'd take a guess that the bulls deal was created by his agent to put pressure on wire to offer a better deal (as I think they did offer him one) then wire refused and the bulls offer was probably the best on the table, with ull not interested at the time we might have been his only option, which is now not the case so hes done one. If thats anywhere near the case then he's better off without us and we're better off without him...its just the timings that cause the headache with a dominant prop shaped hole left in our front row days before the season starts. Get a settlement, get rid and use the loan system to get another prop in from somewhere and pray that Sidlow, Manase and Scruton dont get injured.

some actual quotes from the carvell saga Radford on gc; "There are a lot of issues with the RFL and the Bulls and we’ll have to see how that one stands, but at the minute he is a registered Bradford player. “If things change then my opinion will change on that.” RHP on gc Bulls chief executive Robbie Hunter-Paul said: “Garreth Carvell is contracted to the Bradford Bulls and that contract is registered with the RFL. He’s still a member of our staff.” Hunter-Paul said there had been no contact from Hull yesterday but the Bulls had held dialogue with the player’s agent Andy Clarke. The New Zealander added: “We are exploring all options.” On Gale; Former Bulls forward Radford said: “When Bradford’s issues surfaced we made a play for Luke and were told categorically he was not for sale. “I don’t know if anything has changed but we have a salary cap On Gale, Hunter-Paul added: “Luke Gale is a key member of the Bradford Bulls team and we have big plans for his future here.” ....so, both bradford and hull publically accept that both Gale and Carvell are contracted Bradford players. The dialogue will be about the amount of compensation for carvell as gareth has clearly launched his teddy out of the pram and as Jammie said had done an odemwingie. It looks to me like he probably never really wanted to play for us anyway, I'd take a guess that the bulls deal was created by his agent to put pressure on wire to offer a better deal (as I think they did offer him one) then wire refused and the bulls offer was probably the best on the table, with ull not interested at the time we might have been his only option, which is now not the case so hes done one. If thats anywhere near the case then he's better off without us and we're better off without him...its just the timings that cause the headache with a dominant prop shaped hole left in our front row days before the season starts. Get a settlement, get rid and use the loan system to get another prop in from somewhere and pray that Sidlow, Manase and Scruton dont get injured.

Re: carvell : Tue Feb 11, 2014 10:01 am  

If hull hadn't lost most of their front line through injuries they probably wouldn't
'be interested and non on this would happen

Re: carvell : Tue Feb 11, 2014 10:10 am  

OPTION 5

GC stays at bulls and has a mystery illness, he isn't fit to play so is being paid a high wage and Bulls are still short of props......They agree to release him so they can offload his wage and get in much needed cover...... GC has a miracle recovery and plays for Hull the following week......

Re: carvell : Tue Feb 11, 2014 11:42 am  

My understanding of TUPE is that employess transfered cannot suffer financialy or in a negative way throught the process.
The RUMOUR i heard was that this was not the case, Carvell is the test case so to speak, others will follow if sucessful, why the rfl are not getting involved , and why this is happening quickly (in legal terms).

Re: carvell : Tue Feb 11, 2014 11:54 am  

Option 6 - This thing drags out, Leeds get a long tern injury to one of thier props. Carvells agent then snubs Hull and he joins Leeds, we then get Singleton as a sweetener. Hull are miffed, Bulls are better off and Leeds get a prop.
Oh and Carvell gets more money and doesn't have to travel as far, and his agent gets to got to the Bahamas on holiday.

Re: carvell : Tue Feb 11, 2014 11:55 am  

kinleycat wrote:

My understanding of TUPE is that employess transfered cannot suffer financialy or in a negative way throught the process.
The RUMOUR i heard was that this was not the case, Carvell is the test case so to speak, others will follow if sucessful, why the rfl are not getting involved , and why this is happening quickly (in legal terms).

Oh I love rumours. My rumours bigger than your rumour.