Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:02 pm  

brearley84 wrote:

sidlow is garbage anyway to be fair!

Must be Garbage scored two tries and close to MoM at the magic weekend, who was it against? Shuddersfield, says it all really.

[Bulliac]

Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:01 pm  

ifallwerelikemumby wrote:

Must be Garbage scored two tries and close to MoM at the magic weekend, who was it against? Shuddersfield, says it all really.

Let's hope he can do the biz against the better sides as well as wannabees like them though....

Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:00 pm  

martinwildbull wrote:

ah, the argumentum ad hominem defence beloved of trolls and fishermen. to be fair, his stats for last season compare favourably with Koppys and very favourably with Masons. But its clearly his offload skills that FC is interested in, so lets see how it all gels next season, its my guess he will come on second stint with Heath

comparing sidlow with masons stats for last season! mason was awful last season..and has been shipped out.

Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:13 pm  

brearley84 wrote:

comparing sidlow with masons stats for last season! mason was awful last season..and has been shipped out.

And replaced with a player on silly money who's not managed to get 80 minutes of game time in the last 2 years but is an old mate of the current Giant's head coach.

Though, I've been having a look at the stats and it seems that Kopczak isn't that hard to find a replacement for, it's Bryn Hargreaves' workload that we're going to miss next year. Looking at the stats Kopczak barely scrapes into the top 10 on a lot of important categories for a prop.

For example, Tackles:

Top tackler: Eliot Whitehead with 744
Top tackler at prop: Bryn Hargreaves with 690.
Kopczak is 9th on the over all table with only 353 tackles, only 8 more than Tom Burgess who's game time was not excessive last year.

Carries: Top this time is L'Estrange with 433
Top prop again that man Hargreaves with 389
Kopczak didn't even rate top 10 on this stat with only 200, again shamed by Tom Burgess

Metres: Top is Brett Kearney with 2446
Top prop: Who else? Bryn Hargreaves with 2312
Kopczak scrapes in again at 10th behind Karl Pryce with 1373

Tackle busts, surely a good stat for a barnstorming prop forward?

Not if you're Craig Kopczak it seems as he again fails to be a top ten player for Bradford with only 17.

So looking at all this, I have to wonder if we hadn't had our financial meltdown would Kopczak have been offered the same lucrative deals that were put to Whitehead and Bateman? I'm not sure he would have. He was clearly 3rd prop behind Hargreaves and Manny. His stats back that up. Could be that he asked about a better deal and was knocked back, hence his jumping ship.

Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:16 pm  

brearley84 wrote:

comparing sidlow with masons stats for last season! mason was awful last season..and has been shipped out.

Someone I know at the club told me Hudds wanted Mason to stay but it was his choice to leave.

Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:24 pm  

roofaldo2 wrote:

Though, I've been having a look at the stats and it seems that Kopczak isn't that hard to find a replacement for, it's Bryn Hargreaves' workload that we're going to miss next year. Looking at the stats Kopczak barely scrapes into the top 10 on a lot of important categories for a prop.

For example, Tackles:

Top tackler: Eliot Whitehead with 744
Top tackler at prop: Bryn Hargreaves with 690.
Kopczak is 9th on the over all table with only 353 tackles, only 8 more than Tom Burgess who's game time was not excessive last year.

Carries: Top this time is L'Estrange with 433
Top prop again that man Hargreaves with 389
Kopczak didn't even rate top 10 on this stat with only 200, again shamed by Tom Burgess

Metres: Top is Brett Kearney with 2446
Top prop: Who else? Bryn Hargreaves with 2312
Kopczak scrapes in again at 10th behind Karl Pryce with 1373

Tackle busts, surely a good stat for a barnstorming prop forward?

Not if you're Craig Kopczak it seems as he again fails to be a top ten player for Bradford with only 17.

So looking at all this, I have to wonder if we hadn't had our financial meltdown would Kopczak have been offered the same lucrative deals that were put to Whitehead and Bateman? I'm not sure he would have. He was clearly 3rd prop behind Hargreaves and Manny. His stats back that up. Could be that he asked about a better deal and was knocked back, hence his jumping ship.

Nice selective use of stats. ,If you factor in matches played (Kopczak 17; Hargreaves 26; Manuafakua 23; Burgess 24; Scruton 6) Hargreaves and Kopczak have similar stats per game and were Bradfords hardest working props, but I suspect you knew that You did though intrigue me enough to look and see what we have gained/lost and out of interest what you have also.

Kopczak a bit better with the ball making more yards per carry than Hargreaves and the best tackle bust percentage of any Bradford prop, Hargreaves though was the better defender with lower proportion of missed tackles.

Both Manuafakua and Burgess had a better yards per carry than Kopczak but less carries and tackles per game, probably down to being an interchange. Surprisingly Kopczak had more tackle busts than any Bradford prop, in actual numbers as well as per game. Scruton's stats were frankly poor, but given his injury struggles probably no surprise, I doubt he was ever properly match fit/sharp.

Kopczaks stats are decent, indicating a hardworking prop with decent size. He is an upgrade for Huddersfield Giants over last year.

Adam Sidlow's 2012 stats are comparible to Craig Kopczak's, both played 17 times, Sidlow had 1 more carry in total but made over 100 meters less, he did manage more tackles but missed more (playing in a team who lost more). Again very interesting was tackle busts where Sidlow had 6 more, which may make him Bradford's most dynamic prop next year. As with CK the stas suggest Sidlow is a hardworking prop with decent size. Bradford may well have replaced Kopczak with similar.

The loss for you would be Hargreaves, but if Scruton is fit, he will not be like for like but certainly a proven frontline SL prop. I assume Evans replaces Burgess? I do though think you either need to be very lucky with injuries or need another prop (my view is you need Langley as the physical 13 who will compliment the two young second rows, that triumverate being the strength of your pack 2013 version)

Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:55 pm  

I dont know if you can hear me in Bradford but i am going to SHOUT THIS AGAIN MASON TURNED BRADFORD DOWN

Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:09 pm  

I'm just pleased that it appears from the outside that we are no longer prepared to pay over the odds for average players. If that means missing out on some players and some patience needed then so be it. We're still paying for some big mistakes and will continue to do so for a couple more years yet.

Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:19 pm  

GiantDee wrote:

Nice selective use of stats. ,

So why miss out Sidlows offload rate at 15% of all carries Vs next to nothing for Koppy, and Koppy's error rate at 4% of carries versus Sidlows 1%? A professional coach called Francis Cummins says that apart from the obvious stuff you have mentioned ie low missed tackle rate (but still better than Koppy) etc, he wanted Sidlow for his offload game. I would have thought the discussion would start from that point, rather than ignore it. But at least you agree with your brierley friend, Koppy is a better prop than Mason even if not as good as Sidlow especially for the reasons we signed him.

Re: Bradford swoop for Salfords Sidlow : Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:41 pm  

Mate talk all the crap you want KM was FC first choice Prop but he chose to go somewhere else, so FC thought KM was a better player than AS but what does Franny know