Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 2:26 pm  

Bully_Boxer wrote:

That's a big bill, it seems unclear when the full amount would need to be found but I assume a fair chunk would need to be paid in the next 14 days?

suppose it depends what the final figure they've agreen on is. If its the 350k figure ( less 100k already paid) then it could take some finding. But it sounds like its a lot closer to 133k club thinks and it says they've already paid over 100k. Remaining amount would be in tens of thousands range mentioned in article.

Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 2:37 pm  

Bull Mania wrote:

UPDATE: Taken from T&A

Bradford Bulls rugby league club bosses say they will pay tens of thousands of pounds owed to the taxman.

Officials at HM Revenue and Customs today asked for the club to be wound up at a hearing in a Bankruptcy & Companies Court in London.

But a judge, Registrar Nicholas Briggs, said he would review the case on November 14 after a lawyer representing the club said money would be paid.

The judge heard there was a disagreement over how much the taxman was owed.

Tax officials say the club owes around £350,000 - club bosses say the debt is around £133,000.


Barrister Rowena Page told the judge that more than £100,000 had already been paid.

Outside court, club chairman Marc Green said debts would be cleared.

"I am grateful to my barrister for her ability," he said.

"It is not a comfortable position to be in."

As I said earlier, as a club with cash liquidity problems, paying an extra £200k which you don't believe you owe is not an option. Therefore, the club have taken the decision to pay some, if not all. This appears to have bought them some leniency in the matter and suggests that even the court are unsure if the amount demanded by HMRC is correct.

I'd guess that its somewhere in the middle.

Only problem is that it delays the issue getting sorted and puts yet more doubt in peoples minds. Still we live to fight enough day

Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 2:46 pm  

Not that I advocate companies not paying tax, if we owe 250k then that's 250k more than Vodafone, Starbucks, Amazon, etc pay between them. Why don't THEY get winding ups? Oh, sorry, I forgot, they are so big, they don't actually have to pay a penny, by gentlemens' agreement.

Back to the petition, it seems HMRC couldn't prove the amount claimed, cos if they had, HMRC would've got their order.

Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 3:05 pm  

Is there no information about the actual dispute? What are these amounts in relation to?
VAT? Corp tax? NIC? I'd love to know the cases both sides are putting forward.

Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 3:22 pm  

I'm just guessing when i say this, but i expect this dept to be old, and they keep paying little bits to keep HMRC happy and they have no decided they have had enough and want the lot.

Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 3:23 pm  

Nothus wrote:

Is there no information about the actual dispute? What are these amounts in relation to?
VAT? Corp tax? NIC? I'd love to know the cases both sides are putting forward.

I seem to remember when this first came up there was an article on the Bulls site in which they said it was a dispute over VAT? Presumably if so, it would be over whether or not something is liable to VAT or zero rated.

Perhaps the Judge has said that if we can pay up to what we think is due (the £133k) then he'll stay proceedings while we dispute, but if we can't then there would be no point and he'll wind us up anyway? That would make sense to me but it's pure speculation.

Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 3:51 pm  

Pretty simple really. Green deducts Tax and NI from players and staff wages (when he pays them) and this should be paid to HMRC in a timely manner. Unfortunately for Bulls fans it looks like this isn't happening and it seems to be a pattern of how this guy runs his businesses.

Good luck to the club in getting through this, no fault of the loyal fans who keep getting kicked.

Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 4:03 pm  

el red wrote:

Pretty simple really. Green deducts Tax and NI from players and staff wages (when he pays them) and this should be paid to HMRC in a timely manner. Unfortunately for Bulls fans it looks like this isn't happening and it seems to be a pattern of how this guy runs his businesses.

Good luck to the club in getting through this, no fault of the loyal fans who keep getting kicked.

That is a big assumption presented as a " simple" fact.
PAYE tax and NI are rarely (if ever) taxes which are disputed. The tax and NI due is based on the wages/ income paid. And that amount is a matter of record between the employer and HMRC. That information would have been disclosed to the court/ Judge.
It seems clear that there is a dispute. So to me it is far more likely that VAT is the tax in question.

Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 4:25 pm  

woolly07 wrote:

Come on FA. You really do like to put people down at every opportunity.
It is possible to explain things without appearing all high and mighty.

That last line is what I mean. Was that needed. I expect that from teenagers not a wise, older person.
You write very good points but there is no need to pick apart every point to get one over someone.

Not been on here for a while and come along for a look.

Guess what?

Bradford are in financial trouble and FA is condescending someone.

Groundhog day.

Re: Winding up petition : Mon Oct 31, 2016 6:12 pm  

How can someone get the figures so wrong. Where do we find the money from now?