: Thu May 07, 2009 9:31 am  

Wigan Bull wrote:

Seems a fair enough summing up to me.

The problem lies with player availability though. There just isn't an abundance of world class talent available (as you'd probably expect)

Is an over-abundance of world class a contradiction in terms?

: Thu May 07, 2009 9:32 am  

tigertot wrote:

Is an over-abundance of world class a contradiction in terms?

You know what I mean!!

: Thu May 07, 2009 9:46 am  

tigertot wrote:

Is an over-abundance of world class a contradiction in terms?

Indeed. No doubt that's why he did not use the prefix "over..."?

: Thu May 07, 2009 9:51 am  

Wigan Bull wrote:

Seems a fair enough summing up to me.

The problem lies with player availability though. There just isn't an abundance of world class talent available (as you'd probably expect)

Thats right, especially in the centres, and both Leeds and Saints (amoungst others) might well be looking for a "world class" Centre next year. So whilst I would like us to sign said "world class" Centre, if we have two good players in Sykes and Nero, adequate cover with Menzies/Platt and a promoising youngster in Crookes who needs game time then our cap money could be better spent elsewhere. (on an abundance of world class half backs? ) Its also why its so important to develop our own talent, and just as importantly give them a chance.

Another problem that some folk overlook when we discuss the make up of the squad is we're not comparing like with like as we dont have the facts about the wage structure. In a limited cap a player should be judged against how much cap space he takes up, for example, resigning Morrison on a huge percentage of the cap=bad deal, resigning Morrison on a reduced percentage of the cap=potentially good deal. Signing Fielden on superstar wages=terrible, signing Fielden on squad back up wages=possibly.

: Thu May 07, 2009 10:19 am  

Adeybull wrote:

Indeed. No doubt that's why he did not use the prefix "over..."?

For a change I wasn't taking the p1ss, more thinking aloud. Extending that thought, can you have an abundance of world class?

: Thu May 07, 2009 10:22 am  

tigertot wrote:

For a change I wasn't taking the p1ss, more thinking aloud. Extending that thought, can you have an abundance of world class?

I suppose it would depend on what is considered a "normal" amount.
e.g. the average number of "world class" centres for the last 10 years has been 5. In 2009, there is 7, therefore there is an abundance!?

: Thu May 07, 2009 10:23 am  

Wigan Bull wrote:

I suppose it would depend on what is considered a "normal" amount.
e.g. the average number of "world class" centres for the last 10 years has been 5. In 2009, there is 7, therefore there is an abundance!?

that or hyperbole,exageration and a blind ignoring of the facts

: Thu May 07, 2009 10:33 am  

Wigan Bull wrote:

I suppose it would depend on what is considered a "normal" amount.
e.g. the average number of "world class" centres for the last 10 years has been 5. In 2009, there is 7, therefore there is an abundance!?

From FreeDictionary;

world-class
adj.
1. Ranking among the foremost in the world; of an international standard of excellence; of the highest order: a world-class figure skater.
2. Great, as in importance, concern, or notoriety.

world-class
Adjective
being as good as anyone else in the world in a particular field

I suppose you could have 2 views from that.
1. You are the best available at the time (see Paul Deacon).
2. You have reached a comonly accepted standard of excellence, world-wide (see Sam Burgess).

: Thu May 07, 2009 10:40 am  

Wigan Bull wrote:

I suppose it would depend on what is considered a "normal" amount.
e.g. the average number of "world class" centres for the last 10 years has been 5. In 2009, there is 7, therefore there is an abundance!?

I see no problem with there being an abundance of anything... the word means

an extremely plentiful or oversufficient quantity or supply

dictionary.com

Which can pretty much be summed up as "there are many more available than are needed".

The other thing you need for this discussion is a definition of 'world class'. Possibly something like - of sufficient quality to have a strong chance of being selected for any of the top international sides irrespective of nationality constraints? (e.g. a French centre who would be good enough to play Origin or for Australia/NZ if he qualified).

: Thu May 07, 2009 11:28 am  

ritz wrote: Jeferies is an average player, nothing special, whereas he may not be on much, hes an overseas player, do we look to the here and now or the future? Whereas the reserve players may not be ready yet, when are they? If we resign jefferies its just another yr that they aint gonna get any game time, then another, then another, some reserve players are already wishing they didnt resign and was elsewhere, you gott athrow them in eventually. When did wigan think that tomkins was ready, or ainscough, when did leeds think mcguire, hall kirke etc was ready, when did cas think westerman, shenton owen etc were ready, they same age as some of our reserves, if they aint gonna get any game time they may never be ready. Sorry to drag this up from the 1st page of this world class thread, but this links into this mornings T&A piece; Jeffries wants new deal “I’ve not heard anything from Bradford yet but I’m not going to wait around too long. I like to have decisions made sooner rather than later. I’ve told Macca I want to stay though and my manager is on to it. The ball is in their court but hopefully it will get rolling now.” also interestingly; "Jeffries – who is aiming to have his quota status relaxed to aid his bid to stay..." If he comes off quota in some way that would make his resigning an even easier choice would it not?

ritz wrote: Jeferies is an average player, nothing special, whereas he may not be on much, hes an overseas player, do we look to the here and now or the future? Whereas the reserve players may not be ready yet, when are they? If we resign jefferies its just another yr that they aint gonna get any game time, then another, then another, some reserve players are already wishing they didnt resign and was elsewhere, you gott athrow them in eventually. When did wigan think that tomkins was ready, or ainscough, when did leeds think mcguire, hall kirke etc was ready, when did cas think westerman, shenton owen etc were ready, they same age as some of our reserves, if they aint gonna get any game time they may never be ready. Sorry to drag this up from the 1st page of this world class thread, but this links into this mornings T&A piece; Jeffries wants new deal “I’ve not heard anything from Bradford yet but I’m not going to wait around too long. I like to have decisions made sooner rather than later. I’ve told Macca I want to stay though and my manager is on to it. The ball is in their court but hopefully it will get rolling now.” also interestingly; "Jeffries – who is aiming to have his quota status relaxed to aid his bid to stay..." If he comes off quota in some way that would make his resigning an even easier choice would it not?