Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 12:13 am  

Was fun reading this old thread.

Why did Brett Kenny stop playing for Australia at such a relatively young age (26 ish)? Did he retire from internationals or was he just not selected?

Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 3:20 am  

knockersbumpMKII wrote:

I stopped reading after that first line, absolute b0llocks, not even close.
You put no weight into your arguement whatsoever or have you only being watching rugby for the last 20 years or so..what a noob..

He's actually completely accurate & 100% correct

Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 3:25 am  

roopy wrote:

Johns is easily the best to play the game.
The game I always remember when thinking about his versatility is a Newcastle V Cronulla game where Cronulla had four quality props - Lang, Beattie, Stevens and another I can't recall - who decided the way to beat Newcastle was to run at Johns. I should say that Newcastle had a very weak forward pack on the day due to injuries.
Anyway, Johns sat four rep standard props on their backsides time after time after time with little help from his forwards for 70 minutes, then turned on 10 minutes of attacking brillance to score a try and set up another to pinch a victory.
No other halfback was often the best defender and best attacking player on the field on the same day, as he often was, and then kicked goals at nearly 90%, just for fun.

Another moment that sticks in my mind - Newcastle V Roosters at SFS. Roosters had a very strong side and were expected to win. They led easily till about halfway through the second half when Joey came to life and snatched victory from the Jaws of defeat. The Roosters fans were devastated and stood outside the ground chanting what they thought was a massive insult to departing Knights fans, "You're a one man team". As a Knights fan I was never prouder. Their "insult" was music to my ears.

Testament can be found when if there was even a hint of injury or hint of a rumour that Johns might be out of the team, all betting across Australia was suspended, when he played Newcastle were inevitably favourites if he was actually out they'd plummet to long odds at the drop of a hat, he was so dominant

Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 3:33 am  

knockersbumpMKII wrote:

I'd put Gasnier, Churchill, Raper, beetson, Lewis in front of Johns just off the top of my head, I'd probably have Lockyer over Johns as well. From over here Hanley was a better player, Millward, Murphy and a fair few more from these shores.

Even Jonathan Davies is a better all round player than Johns, better kicker, had greater awareness, more speed (off the mark and top end), greater elusiveness, yeah Johns is the superior passer but JD is by far the superior player. Is JD the greatest ever..no but for me his all round talents put him firmly around the top 10 of all time.
deciding whom is the greatest is impossible, some players were unbelievably talented but played in unpopular/unfashionable teams and don't get the recognition. Some are elevated because they were in amazing teams and seemed to have all the time in the world and/or were dominant.

You put your nominated best player in any poor side and if the changes are vastly noticeable then you have a bona-fide nominee..

Can i have some???

Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 6:39 am  

Interesting that Slater hasn't been mentioned and Smith only fleetingly. 2 brilliant played who when this thread is run again in 5 years will feature more prominently.

Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 7:34 am  

wire-quin wrote:

Interesting that Slater hasn't been mentioned and Smith only fleetingly. 2 brilliant played who when this thread is run again in 5 years will feature more prominently.

Smith may well take the mantle from Johns, he's the only one who can

People are mentioning a lot of players who are pure athletes & incredibly agile

Smith & Johns were / are pure footy players, both incredible students of the game, both have brains as well as all the weapons they need / needed to play their position or turn a game on its head

Thurston is a bees prick away from these two, as a half he hasn't got the strength & defence of Johns

Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 8:53 am  

I think Thurston would get a lot more mentions now. Best player i've ever seen.

As was said in the thread, it's a subjective argument. With the WC been one day away, a special mention to the British indomitables team. Fantastic story and the last team to be unbeaten in a test series against Australia. When you see the journey they had, compared to Englands business Emirates flight, be interesting to compare the results. Some great players in that team. Gus Risman, Trevor Foster, Ernest Ward, Willie Horne.

Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 9:16 am  

Bull Mania wrote:

I think Thurston would get a lot more mentions now. Best player i've ever seen.

As was said in the thread, it's a subjective argument. With the WC been one day away, a special mention to the British indomitables team. Fantastic story and the last team to be unbeaten in a test series against Australia. When you see the journey they had, compared to Englands business Emirates flight, be interesting to compare the results. Some great players in that team. Gus Risman, Trevor Foster, Ernest Ward, Willie Horne.

i always though Thurston was very good but not great, but the last 4-5 years i have changed my mind, better than Johns and sterling, best Aussie 7 i have ever seen.

Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 9:25 am  

Here's my candidates from SL in the time I've been watching (2001 onwards). I appreciate Lockyer, Johns, Fitler, Thurston etc will be better but I've not watched enough NRL to comment:

Back - Richards
Adds so much value to a team. His strength was a big asset finishing off from close range and driving the ball out of his own 20. His height/aerial ability made him a big target for cross-field kicks, and made them a none-option for the opposition. A very strong defender which seemed to demand opposition teams mainly attacked the other wing. He could kick a drop out 50 metres before it bounced, kick a drop goal from half way, a very accurate goal kicker. The only negative I can think of for Richards is that he wasn't agile, but once he got going, nobody would catch him.

Halfback - Long
He just seemed to run teams ragged, great vision, controlled the game, brilliant field kicker. Man of steel, three time Lance Todd trophy winner. Saints won four Grand Finals, six Challenge Cups and two World Club Challenges with him, once he left they were a spent force. Most importantly, he proved he could do it at the top level by having stormers in the most recent two times we beat the aussies, including on their turf after Mason took him out with an elbow off the ball, Long went on to tear them apart. He did has his negatives, the major one obviously being his significant off-field issues. Also not a great defender and maybe lacking some pace, but I don't see how we can eulogise the aussies, yet ignore a halfback who took them apart twice in an inferior team.

Forward - Peacock
Props are bound to be overlooked in these threads because their job is focused on the tough stuff rather that throwing flashy passes or making full length breaks, yet people commonly say halves can't play behind a beaten pack. Peacock epiitomises that hard graft that goes unnoticed, and is clearly a great leader. No co-incidence that when he was at Bradford we had bullmania, then as soon as he left they went down the pan and the club he joined, Leeds, became the dominant force. Again, he's proved himself against the aussies, playing in our most recent three wins against them, and scoring tries in two of those games. His performance in the 2006 win was outstanding, putting Mason on his backside and dragging four players over the line to score are two of my all time favourite rugby moments. I can't even think of a negative for him really, I suppose if he had better handling skills he could have been even better, but that wasn't his role.

Re: Greatest player of all time? : Thu Oct 26, 2017 9:26 am  

Muggins wrote:

Was fun reading this old thread.

Why did Brett Kenny stop playing for Australia at such a relatively young age (26 ish)? Did he retire from internationals or was he just not selected?

a combination of some niggley injuries, and the no nonsense from is everything approach of Aussie selectors. Players like Peter Jackson emerged as firstly a centre then even usurped wally at 6, pluslikes of mcgaw Et kept kenny out of a centre spot, meninga re emergence as a test centre and captain after a couple of lean years. laurie daley breaking through.

The Australian selectors were pretty ruthless back then and still are to some extent its one of the reasons they are so good they don't d**k about like we do, none of this "he aint international class" if some ones playing well they get a shirt and get given a go. we suffer badly at not having the guts to drop players and pick new players.

slightly off topic but its a shame more stand offs don't start out at centre so many great players started their trade at centre before moving to 6 after a few years learning the game there and gradually expanding there skill set. hopefully Sutcliffe at Leeds will start this way out, too many young halves either struggle to guide a team around or get shunted out to full back.
Daley, Fittler, schofield, jackson, and severel others started at centre,