As I said on another thread Wigan won the competition with 9 o/seas players and supposedly the best youth set up in the country and Hull KR are the bad ones..

Rovers appear to have benefitted from signing younger players from australia during their first two Super League seasons and getting at least 5 good years of service out of them which has led them to be in the situation they are now.



Maybe they should have signed 32 year old over the hill players and been shot of them by now???

The fact that Hull KR will be looking at having 10 non-english players in their first choice starting 17 to me next year is a disgrace. The fact that Hull KR, despite bending the rules so much, are so far behind Leeds, Wigan, Wire, Saints and Hudds it's unreal is amusing, god help them when Justin has to play on the same playing field as everyone else.

Blake Green (who?) a great player?

Yeah Yeah, you don't rate him the same as Tool didn't rate that Dobson kid three years ago, great judgement eh.





Oh and wasn't Motu Tony going to be a better full-back then Shaun Briscoe, how did that work out?

It wasn't the fact that 'Tool' didn't rate Dobson, it's that;



a) We didn't have a quota space avaliable

b) We didn't value him as highly as you did, which co incidently neither did Wigan (the reigning SL champs)



He's certainly a more competent attacker than Briscoe which is something our team needed especially in light of losing Mr Cooke, unfortunately he was very unlucky with injury. How's Briscoe doing btw? Hull KR fans still calling for Ben Cockayne to replace him?

Obviously no space for two SL clubs in Hull then

We are of course talking many years ago when the clubs weren't drawing 12,000 (Hull) and 8000 (Rovers) home crowds, more then several SL clubs, and also packing 20,000+ into the KC for derbies.





Oh and both clubs selling a $hitload of passes and merchandise between them.







Oh and both taking great numbers away.





Oh yeah, as well as great support to the MM event.



But apart from that, you're right, not enough space for both clubs.

A player of Dobson's quality would have been worth Hull making quota space, don't think anyone could argue that.





Great judgement by Justin & Neil then eh.







Briscoe? Doing great, England's number one in the eyes of many.

Haven’t read through the thread but the fact remains Rovers are operating within the rules, if they weren’t than surly the RFL would act??!



I have no problem at all with how our squad is shaping up, however we’ve seen a glimpse of some real potential coming through especially in the forwards. As long as their progression isn’t hampered by our overseas signing than I’ve no problem. As above is all within the rules......

Hull FC Overseas position.

Berrigan

O'Meley

Manu

Fitzgibbon

Lauaki

Cusack

Moa



Cussack going out but looking to be replaced by another overseas player. Yet the limit is 5 next season, surely the homegrown greats of FC wouldn't flout a loophole in the rules by getting Manu and Berrigan off quota and thats a team that didn;t even get to the 2nd round of the playoffs. Do you realise your highest paid quota player is your back up hooker??

I personally wasn't happy when Berrigan came off quota and though we have an overseas space avaliable we aren't doing all we can to fill that space up with any Aussie and most of the players we've been linked with are English. We have (at the very most) 7 overseas players next year which is on par with the rest of SL. We also have brought a number of players through our own academy into our team, how many have you brought through your academy that have made it into your first team on a regular basis?

so you will be over the 5 allowed? Its an absolute disgrace a club like Hull FC with all those potential jnrs in Hull are flouting and bending the rules and destroying the chances of England RL winning the next WC blah de blah de blah.....

Still against the spirit of the rules and in fact in your words 'bending the rules'. Its not on a par with Leeds, Saints etc..Agar has stated in the press on numerous occassions he is looking to the NRL for a back up half back.



I agree you have brought through a few players from your academy its just a shame that most of them have been shipped out for either being not good enough or having a bad attitude, the remaining few you have you want rid of, Horne / Yeaman / Washbrooke / Radford.



Briscoe is the one exception who IIRC is from Fev.



This year our academy products were Welham, Latus, Taylor and Watts (I know he came from cas but we got him at 17). Add to that we had Murrell & Cockayne who we brought through from a young age.

Jesus, that's a hell of a post archive you must have.

[url=http://viewtopic.php?f=2&t=285826&p=12203921#p12203921not really[/url

Ah right, fair dues.





FTR I still think the best ever HKR import is Byron Ford, remember him tb?

Technically its 8 as Hanson was born and raised in salford, and has come through the wigan acadamy, he plays for samoa due to parents.



And this season, we have 3 imports leaving and 3 coming in, who are class, not journeymen, one of those only for a year till hock comes back, then pretty much the entire starting pack will be english (depending on how we use lima).



Also cant see phelps staying, so thats one less, and carmont only has another year left and will be leaving hopefully to be replaced by charnley.



Its been slow going getting over the Maurice era, but we are certainly getting there. Dont think we made a bad decision letting most of them go.

You can't have a massive go at Wigan, as they do produce the players. Just because they end up at other clubs (a la Brown and Robinson, both of whom are in the England squad) isn't the end of the world.

They do give youth a chance and also sign english players - gleeson/fielden/coley/Pryce. As I stated earlier, sooner or later all clubs are going to have the reduced number of imports and English talent will be given the chance it deserves. The players they've got on the way in from Melbourne are good ones, so will improve the league.

Two Wigan youngsters have just signed for Wakefield.

Again, its not the guys coming in for Wigan this year who are the problem, Its the average players who are already there. The Cameron Phelps and George Carmonts.



Look at Charnley, he will benefit much more from being first grade next year than he will from another year sat behind Carmont.



A good example would be Ainscough, here is a kid with with stacks of potential but some big deficiencies in his game. Imagine how much better as league, as a sport, and as a national side we would be if Wigan, rather than going out and signing a phelps, or Roberts, who arent world class, needed to work with Ainscough and make the best of him, rather than replace him with a ready made aussie import? We are never going to catch up to Australia filling our league with players not good enough for them, we need to produce our own, better players.



Whilst Wigan should be congratulated for their youth development, their commitment to giving british players a chance isnt good enough.

Daryl Goulding, who has come on leaps and bounds this year, has been keeping out roberts and phelps, so doesnt really work that argument does it?



Plus every player has been given a chance this year when it has been earned, the only two who have not improved the weak aspects of their games are feka and ainscough. Hence they have been allowed to leave.

quite the opposite, it pretty much supports that argument. If Roberts and Phelps are 2nd choice for Wigan, then they shouldnt be at Wigan. The player acting as cover for Daryl Goulding should be the next Daryl Goulding, not a 29 year old Australian



its a bit of a self-fulfilling argument here. However the fact remains, that we would be better placed as a sport to be forcing clubs like Wigan to invest more time and energy in players like Ainscough and doing everything we can, as a sport to make sure we are helping these players fulfil their potential.



I think the fact no-one at Wigan could teach Ainscough how to basically catch a ball is indicative of the problems we have in bringing through new players. This part isnt particularly aimed at Wigan, it is just a good example.

No too sure about that,Roberts was one of your stars before he was injured, wasn't he?



In a couple of years the foreign guys exempt from the quota at Wigan and HKR will have reduced in number as they've retired and moved on. You mentioned Ainscough, well he's got himself a super league club for next year, depsite the deficincies you've mentioned, probably because Bradford aren't allowed to sign a Joe Dakiotoga character from down under.

Wakefield were masters of filling their ranks with journey men ockers, now they're signing Josh Veivers and Chris Dean. Cas have signed Emmit, a fringe player from Saints. All of this goes to show there's more oppotunities for young british players than a couple of years ago.



The quota rules are slowly taking effect. We just need to stick with them and in say 3 years we should be severely down on foreigners in the SL.

But they didnt start the season as second choice, infact only injury made them miss games and gouldings good play was rewarded by keeping his place. Under noble, he would have been out as soon as roberts, (who was in amazing form before his injury) or phelps returned to fitness. I also very much doubt phelps will be here next year anyway.



Maybe your onto something with ainscough, why didnt the coaching staff think to teach him how to catch? Or is it more likely that they have tried, however somethings just dont sink in like having to jump when your opposing winger jumps to give your already short stature a fighting chance. Also I dont think you can teach a rugby brain, and i dont think that lad has one, granted he is fast.