Re: Wembley contract : Tue Jun 11, 2024 4:38 am  

If you move the Challenge Cup final away from Wembley, then I think that will be the first step towards there not being a Challenge Cup anymore.

The Wembley tradition is a huge part of it, and if you take that away then it's the start of the slow death.

There are plenty of reasons why it is never likely to have a 90,000 full house ever again, but if you move it to a ground in the north with a smaller capacity - Anfield, Etihad, Elland Road, St James' Park being the most obvious choices - then I bet it wouldn't sell those out either. Elland Road maybe, but no chance the others.

Leave Wembley and within ten years I reckon the Cup is no more.

Re: Wembley contract : Tue Jun 11, 2024 12:35 pm  

Barstool Preacher wrote:

The Wembley tradition is a huge part of it, and if you take that away then it's the start of the slow death.

Up until this year, I would have agreed with you 100%, but now I have changed my mind. My whole experience around the event this year was pretty bad - and I would have said that even if we had won the match. It just seems crazy to me now, in a cost of living crisis, that thousands of people from towns in the north travel all that way down south, just to pump money into London's economy. What happened to the 'levelling up' agenda? As for tradition, yes, point taken, but traditions change. We didn't used to be called Warrington Wolves, we didn't used to have Grand Finals, but things evolve. I would miss what Wembley used to represent, years ago, but we're fooling ourselves if we think that it's still the same as it used to be.

Re: Wembley contract : Tue Jun 11, 2024 12:54 pm  

The Speculator wrote:

Up until this year, I would have agreed with you 100%, but now I have changed my mind. My whole experience around the event this year was pretty bad - and I would have said that even if we had won the match. It just seems crazy to me now, in a cost of living crisis, that thousands of people from towns in the north travel all that way down south, just to pump money into London's economy. What happened to the 'levelling up' agenda? As for tradition, yes, point taken, but traditions change. We didn't used to be called Warrington Wolves, we didn't used to have Grand Finals, but things evolve. I would miss what Wembley used to represent, years ago, but we're fooling ourselves if we think that it's still the same as it used to be.

I'm in the same boat. It was a pretty poor experience for upwards of £250 worth of expenditure for me and the family. The days of attendances requiring a 90K stadium are over and have been for 35+ years.

Re: Wembley contract : Wed Jun 12, 2024 7:15 am  

I'm not saying Wembley is brilliant, but the issues with it are primarily that rugby league just can't come close to filling it, rather than the ground itself.

I don't think that is going to get any better at a ground in the north, and once you take the Wembley tradition away, then before long the Cup will go altogether. Tradition is the only reason why it exists now, and there's no heritage in a downgraded final in Liverpool, Leeds or Manchester.

You could possibly try moving it around a bit and going to popular grounds like Cardiff or Murrayfield. That might see a short term boost, but in a few years time their novelty will have worn off for the clubs that regularly get there and neutrals that go regularly too, and attendances will drop just like Wembley's have.

If you want a near full house and better atmosphere then by all means move it to Elland Road, but if you're moving a final that has been played at the national stadium in London for a century to a stadium with less than half it's capacity in Leeds, then you're already more or less admitting the competition is past it's sell by date in my opinion.

Re: Wembley contract : Wed Jun 12, 2024 7:17 am  

As the years have past there has been a massive reduction in working men's clubs and works staff organising trips to Wembley regardless of the teams that play. There not two teams who can put the numbers required to help fill the stadium, its a sad indictment of the game now but its true people cannot afford to shell out the extortionate costs in our rip off country and its only getting worse.

Re: Wembley contract : Wed Jun 12, 2024 8:14 am  

Barstool Preacher wrote:

I'm not saying Wembley is brilliant, but the issues with it are primarily that rugby league just can't come close to filling it, rather than the ground itself.

I don't think that is going to get any better at a ground in the north, and once you take the Wembley tradition away, then before long the Cup will go altogether. Tradition is the only reason why it exists now, and there's no heritage in a downgraded final in Liverpool, Leeds or Manchester.

You could possibly try moving it around a bit and going to popular grounds like Cardiff or Murrayfield. That might see a short term boost, but in a few years time their novelty will have worn off for the clubs that regularly get there and neutrals that go regularly too, and attendances will drop just like Wembley's have.

If you want a near full house and better atmosphere then by all means move it to Elland Road, but if you're moving a final that has been played at the national stadium in London for a century to a stadium with less than half it's capacity in Leeds, then you're already more or less admitting the competition is past it's sell by date in my opinion.

Fair points. Re: sell by date it's dying on it's booty now though. The invention of the 1895 Cup to attempt to boost the crowd is an attempt to arrest the decline. It's a real shame but since the advent of SL / Sky / Grand Final the CC has been tinkered with and messed about with too much - dates, venues etc. Taken with the fact an SL club need only win 3 games in a row to get there (used to be 4) the magic has gone, at least for me it has.

This is before we consider the costs of getting there and the underwhelming experience once you do.

Re: Wembley contract : Wed Jun 12, 2024 8:15 am  

Snaggletooth wrote:

As the years have past there has been a massive reduction in working men's clubs and works staff organising trips to Wembley regardless of the teams that play. There not two teams who can put the numbers required to help fill the stadium, its a sad indictment of the game now but its true people cannot afford to shell out the extortionate costs in our rip off country and its only getting worse.

There were no other RL counter attractions in the past.

Wembley was THE big day out and lots of fans did save all year and went there on an annual pilgrimage.

Now we have the Magic Weekend, fans travelling to Catalans Dragons games (To watch their own team) and also the Grand Final.

Most people just can`t afford the money to attend those games and to go to Wembley as a neutral fan too.

Re: Wembley contract : Wed Jun 12, 2024 7:08 pm  

I like Wembley.
I don’t like it as much as the Empire Stadium, but I go in Club Wembley, so I find the experience good.

The Grand Final is the reason the CC is diluted, not the event. Up until then, it was the ultimate prize and homage for many fans.

It still is no1 for me, and I’d swap any GF for a CC, although after last weekend, it is trying my traditionalist view.

Re: Wembley contract : Wed Jun 12, 2024 7:15 pm  

rubber duckie wrote:

It still is no1 for me, and I’d swap any CC final for a GF, although after last weekend, it is trying my traditionalist view.

I'd swap 2010, 2012, and 2019 for a GF win, especially that 2016 GF over Wigan for the LLS and GF double.

Re: Wembley contract : Wed Jun 12, 2024 9:20 pm  

I think the Challenge Cup as a competition has lost a lot of it's edge, just as the domestic cups have in football. I say that as someone who has attended all seven CC finals that Wires have been in since 2009, and who has also been at Wembley to see my football team win both the FA Cup and the League Cup.

The big difference really is those finals could still sell the ground out twice over, while the CCF looks like a poor "event" with 30,000 empty seats.

There is still some magic in it. I felt it in 2009 and 2010, and I bet Leigh fans felt it last year. I'm absolutely desperate for us to win the Grand Final though and would sacrifice a lot for that. Regardless of what any "traditionalist" says either, the Grand Final is absolutely the one that matters now.