Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 8:14 am  

This season with 5 games to go only 3 teams have "dead rubbers" which is better than previous years-. Wire fans (and hull) are moaning about the system because you both happen to be one of them. Perhaps next year you would prefer to continue where youve left off and finish a little lower - that would make sure you had something to play for? Or perhaps he team will concentrate on finishing as high as possible- as who knows what the RFL will come up with for next year and how your position in the table could affect you.

Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 8:48 am  

No Jools. I don't deny had we had finished near top maybe I wouldn't be as concerned but finishing only 6th and having a seemingly impossible chance to make the 4 has certainly secured my opinion on it being a flawed concept as it stands.

If you are going to have a system that is designed to give a chance for 8 teams to be in the mix, there must be a measure involed that gives the bottom teams a realistic target.

I'm a critic of this system as it stands and I will always be even if we sweep the board next season. I don't want to see us batter a team in 8th and end all their chances, leaving them with 6 dead rubbers, that is of no benifit to any spectator or any team.

Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:15 am  

I think this system makes more sense if you think of these 7 games as just an extension of the season & the eventual top 4 as the play off section. The format was set out clearly though that all league points mattered right up to the top 4 play offs. Some clubs seem to have understood the instructions better than others.

Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:24 am  

ninearches wrote:

I think this system makes more sense if you think of these 7 games as just an extension of the season & the eventual top 4 as the play off section. The format was set out clearly though that all league points mattered right up to the top 4 play offs. Some clubs seem to have understood the instructions better than others.

The cut off is important as it gives the clubs in the middle of the table a reason to fight on as they need to avoid the middle 8s.

Format is superb and I think it will add some real spice to things moving forward. If Wire's signings work next season there will be Warrington, Wigan, Leeds, Saints, Huddersfield and Cas all fighting for 4 spaces. That is what we need and it's that kind of competition that will improve standards.

Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:26 am  

Some of the posts in this thread are total rubbish.

Every minute has mattered and we've been too slack, we've lacked the intensity for it every week and been too poor overall and it's now biting us on the backside. Plus every minute remaining should matter to help us become a better team ongoing. The remaining games could be huge for the likes of Wilde, the King brothers, Sandow etc. to really get them to become part of this team.

This is the best system we've had in rugby league imo. It's very exciting. The bottom 8s have a relegated team and others fight for money for placement and a trophy; the middle 8s are excellent, toss a coin and anybody could be staying/coming up or staying/going down; the top 8s now have 5 of 8 teams still fighting for something with just five games to go and then the Play-offs start which will raise the bar and intensity further.

Just because we are a bang average side overall and we're neither good enough or crap enough to be part of any proper excitement in the final weeks of our season isn't the system's fault. It's our fault for all those missed tackles and lack of line speed and dropped balls and poorly executed plays we've put in over-and-over all season.

When we've had LAnderson MKing Solomona Briers Cooper Carvell Morley Hodgson MMonaghan Waterhouse etc. all leave us and us bring in nowhere near the same quality to replace them or we've promoted young and inexperienced lads, some of which aren't actually ready for first grade rugby (they need an 'A' team as the jump from 19s to first team is too big), that is why we're in this position. Not the system.

The system is fine. We are not fine. It's our fault!

We have a sprinkling of elite players who'd get in any side, we've got a sprinkling of very poor players at this level who'd make Halifax and Sheffield better but don't make us better, we have a lot of young inexperienced players who need more years in the team to start making game changing impacts, we look like we don't have a game plan/executed plays/structures to our play and our defensive line hardly ever comes forward. We've had no kicking game all season and haven't had a leading half back (Sandow will be that next season but needs time to settle in).

This is all why we have "nothing to play for"(we do) or "five dead rubbers", not the system.

Plus even if they are just five dead rubbers. That's no different to all those sides in the Championship who've not been able to gain promotion for all these years, they've had years of dead rubbers. And all those Premier League mid table teams who won't get into Europe and won't get relegated, they have 38 dead rubbers every season. And the likes of Marussia, McLaren, Force India, Lotus, Torro Rosso, Sauba in Formula One; they have no chance of even winning a race this season (or any season in most cases), never mind the winning the F1 championship, so they have a whole season of dead rubbers.

But they don't look at it like that. They go out and put in the work for the to do as well as they possibly can whether they have a realistic chance of succeeding or not. So why should that be different or a problem for Warringotn RLFC?

Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:27 am  

Saddened! wrote:

The cut off is important as it gives the clubs in the middle of the table a reason to fight on as they need to avoid the middle 8s.

Format is superb and I think it will add some real spice to things moving forward. If Wire's signings work next season there will be Warrington, Wigan, Leeds, Saints, Huddersfield and Cas all fighting for 4 spaces. That is what we need and it's that kind of competition that will improve standards.

Hull have signed very well and will have one of the best packs in the league next season as well.

Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:34 am  

rubber duckie wrote:

No Jools. I don't deny had we had finished near top maybe I wouldn't be as concerned but finishing only 6th and having a seemingly impossible chance to make the 4 has certainly secured my opinion on it being a flawed concept as it stands.

If you are going to have a system that is designed to give a chance for 8 teams to be in the mix, there must be a measure involed that gives the bottom teams a realistic target.

I'm a critic of this system as it stands and I will always be even if we sweep the board next season. I don't want to see us batter a team in 8th and end all their chances, leaving them with 6 dead rubbers, that is of no benifit to any spectator or any team.

You are judging it solely on Warrington's performance this season.

What you need to do is understand the reasons behind the change. The criticism was that league position wasn't rewarded sufficiently in the Play Offs and the big teams could play halfheartedly for three quarters of the season and still won the competition. There were scores of low intensity games in previous seasons where one of the two sides were clearly coasting to manage their season.

This model is about as good as you can get. The bottom 6 clubs are in a dogfight to avoid the middle 8s and potentially career and earnings-ruining relegation. The top 6 clubs are in a fight to make the top 4, with even the big sides unable to coast for more than the odd game or they will risk losing their top 4 space. Saints are in this position now, there is a real chance we could miss out if we lose to Cas & Huddersfield.

At the end of the day, Warrington are struggling to reach a position where they can compete for the Grand Final. That isn't the fault of the system, it's the fact you've not been good enough. A mate of mine made the point last weekend, would Chris Sandow be here now if we still had the old system?

Viva la system!

Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:35 am  

BuckleyStreetWire wrote:

Hull have signed very well and will have one of the best packs in the league next season as well.

They very often have a good squad on paper. It never seems to work out to much though.

Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:36 am  

BuckleyStreetWire wrote:

Some of the posts in this thread are total rubbish.

Every minute has mattered and we've been too slack, we've lacked the intensity for it every week and been too poor overall and it's now biting us on the backside. Plus every minute remaining should matter to help us become a better team ongoing. The remaining games could be huge for the likes of Wilde, the King brothers, Sandow etc. to really get them to become part of this team.

This is the best system we've had in rugby league imo. It's very exciting. The bottom 8s have a relegated team and others fight for money for placement and a trophy; the middle 8s are excellent, toss a coin and anybody could be staying/coming up or staying/going down; the top 8s now have 5 of 8 teams still fighting for something with just five games to go and then the Play-offs start which will raise the bar and intensity further.

Just because we are a bang average side overall and we're neither good enough or crap enough to be part of any proper excitement in the final weeks of our season isn't the system's fault. It's our fault for all those missed tackles and lack of line speed and dropped balls and poorly executed plays we've put in over-and-over all season.

When we've had LAnderson MKing Solomona Briers Cooper Carvell Morley Hodgson MMonaghan Waterhouse etc. all leave us and us bring in nowhere near the same quality to replace them or we've promoted young and inexperienced lads, some of which aren't actually ready for first grade rugby (they need an 'A' team as the jump from 19s to first team is too big), that is why we're in this position. Not the system.

The system is fine. We are not fine. It's our fault!

We have a sprinkling of elite players who'd get in any side, we've got a sprinkling of very poor players at this level who'd make Halifax and Sheffield better but don't make us better, we have a lot of young inexperienced players who need more years in the team to start making game changing impacts, we look like we don't have a game plan/executed plays/structures to our play and our defensive line hardly ever comes forward. We've had no kicking game all season and haven't had a leading half back (Sandow will be that next season but needs time to settle in).

This is all why we have "nothing to play for"(we do) or "five dead rubbers", not the system.

Plus even if they are just five dead rubbers. That's no different to all those sides in the Championship who've not been able to gain promotion for all these years, they've had years of dead rubbers. And all those Premier League mid table teams who won't get into Europe and won't get relegated, they have 38 dead rubbers every season. And the likes of Marussia, McLaren, Force India, Lotus, Torro Rosso, Sauba in Formula One; they have no chance of even winning a race this season (or any season in most cases), never mind the winning the F1 championship, so they have a whole season of dead rubbers.

But they don't look at it like that. They go out and put in the work for the to do as well as they possibly can whether they have a realistic chance of succeeding or not. So why should that be different or a problem for Warringotn RLFC?

Re: 5 Dead Rubbers : Fri Aug 14, 2015 9:51 am  

BuckleyStreetWire wrote:

Some of the posts in this thread are total rubbish.

Every minute has mattered and we've been too slack, we've lacked the intensity for it every week and been too poor overall and it's now biting us on the backside. Plus every minute remaining should matter to help us become a better team ongoing. The remaining games could be huge for the likes of Wilde, the King brothers, Sandow etc. to really get them to become part of this team.

This is the best system we've had in rugby league imo. It's very exciting. The bottom 8s have a relegated team and others fight for money for placement and a trophy; the middle 8s are excellent, toss a coin and anybody could be staying/coming up or staying/going down; the top 8s now have 5 of 8 teams still fighting for something with just five games to go and then the Play-offs start which will raise the bar and intensity further.

Just because we are a bang average side overall and we're neither good enough or crap enough to be part of any proper excitement in the final weeks of our season isn't the system's fault. It's our fault for all those missed tackles and lack of line speed and dropped balls and poorly executed plays we've put in over-and-over all season.

When we've had LAnderson MKing Solomona Briers Cooper Carvell Morley Hodgson MMonaghan Waterhouse etc. all leave us and us bring in nowhere near the same quality to replace them or we've promoted young and inexperienced lads, some of which aren't actually ready for first grade rugby (they need an 'A' team as the jump from 19s to first team is too big), that is why we're in this position. Not the system.

The system is fine. We are not fine. It's our fault!

We have a sprinkling of elite players who'd get in any side, we've got a sprinkling of very poor players at this level who'd make Halifax and Sheffield better but don't make us better, we have a lot of young inexperienced players who need more years in the team to start making game changing impacts, we look like we don't have a game plan/executed plays/structures to our play and our defensive line hardly ever comes forward. We've had no kicking game all season and haven't had a leading half back (Sandow will be that next season but needs time to settle in).

This is all why we have "nothing to play for"(we do) or "five dead rubbers", not the system.

Plus even if they are just five dead rubbers. That's no different to all those sides in the Championship who've not been able to gain promotion for all these years, they've had years of dead rubbers. And all those Premier League mid table teams who won't get into Europe and won't get relegated, they have 38 dead rubbers every season. And the likes of Marussia, McLaren, Force India, Lotus, Torro Rosso, Sauba in Formula One; they have no chance of even winning a race this season (or any season in most cases), never mind the winning the F1 championship, so they have a whole season of dead rubbers.

But they don't look at it like that. They go out and put in the work for the to do as well as they possibly can whether they have a realistic chance of succeeding or not. So why should that be different or a problem for Warringotn RLFC?

Best post I've seen on here for a good while.