Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Thu Jul 27, 2023 8:48 am  

Barbed Wire wrote:

It must be my misinterpretation of your post then, and I’m sorry if that is the case. I think if anything, the fall from an exciting young product who featured a few times under Price, showing promise and gaining Knights caps, to bouncing around and on loan deals until his contract expires is a sorry reflection of the club. We all question why players from the academy don’t produce as often to top first team players at Warrington, and the handling of Longstaff is another example of what could be wrong. The same with Dean, Thewlis, Wrench etc. in recent years. They are the easy scapegoat to drop.

It’s truly frustrating to watch. And I dread to think who will be on the right wing on Sunday in the same spirit. With Minikin, Russell, Wrench and Thewlis all ultimately fighting for that place (assuming he picks Matautia, Ratchford and Ashton in the rest of the back line), the one player almost certain not to get picked is Wrench. Then likely Minikin 3rd choice. Do we then pick a brilliant young player in Thewlis, or go with Russell?

Are we set to be having the same conversation about Wrench in 2 years, if we kick him around the reserves, loans etc. and then reflect that actually he wasn’t that good after all when he lands at a championship club who lure him in with the promise of getting picked every week. And the cycle starts again.

This I agree with totally. Something is going wrong in the development.

I also have spoken out about the dropping of young players when we lose a game, but we don't drop the favourites no matter what their form is. e.g.) Having Dean play for Castleford whilst we put Matautia in the halves (and still lose by the way) is not right. It sends a terrible message to young players. Same again goes for Green being dropped but Dudson with a continually weak stats performance being kept in the side.

Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Thu Jul 27, 2023 9:00 am  

Wires71 wrote:

This I agree with totally. Something is going wrong in the development.

I also have spoken out about the dropping of young players when we lose a game, but we don't drop the favourites no matter what their form is. e.g.) Having Dean play for Castleford whilst we put Matautia in the halves (and still lose by the way) is not right. It sends a terrible message to young players. Same again goes for Green being dropped but Dudson with a continually weak stats performance being kept in the side.

We’re trying to grow plants in a broken greenhouse, blaming the plants, chucking them away and doing exactly the same thing again expecting different results.

Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Thu Jul 27, 2023 11:12 am  

Then who do you turn to when all these old fogies run out of steam? It isn't just a Wire problem . Apart from a very few ,clubs in-house player development is abysmal & will continue to dwindle in the future. Unless school led player development is put in place our game will soon be no more than a memory .

And we can't depend on a steady stream of usually overrated Aussies ,over here for their last pay days because they can't get games in the NRL ,but can look quite good against many of our homegrown players.

Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Fri Jul 28, 2023 6:33 am  

ninearches wrote:

Then who do you turn to when all these old fogies run out of steam? It isn't just a Wire problem . Apart from a very few ,clubs in-house player development is abysmal & will continue to dwindle in the future. Unless school led player development is put in place our game will soon be no more than a memory .

And we can't depend on a steady stream of usually overrated Aussies ,over here for their last pay days because they can't get games in the NRL ,but can look quite good against many of our homegrown players.

Very much with you on this. If you go through all the Super League clubs they seem to want to ensure they get their full quota of overseas players at all times.

Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Fri Jul 28, 2023 8:02 am  

Smiffy27 wrote:

Very much with you on this. If you go through all the Super League clubs they seem to want to ensure they get their full quota of overseas players at all times.

The number of quota players needs to be reduced gradually, until clubs are only allowed to play a maximum of 2 in their match day 17 man squad.

Clubs will then have to nurture and PLAY their own young talent then.

[Winslade's Offload]

Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Fri Jul 28, 2023 10:20 am  

ratticusfinch wrote:

In terms of Longstaff (and I was a huge fan initially) we can't really blame Powell/Wire for his arrested development. Hull clearly didn't see enough to sign him on (despite some of their fans being keen) and he's barely troubled the Salford 17. 3 pretty experienced coaches can't ALL be wrong.

One thing our youngsters, particularly the forwards, seem to lack against Wigan/Saints/Leeds Academy players is size.

I think this is probably the correct analysis. We got Longstaff when he was dropped from the Wigan Scholarship back in 2019. He is an ex England Youth player and has consistently shown promise during his development. But he doesn't have a big physique and when he played for us he was routinely pushed back when he took the ball up. Yes he is quick, and he is at his best 'poaching' tries. So if there is a break, he will be on the shoulder of the player, and if the ball is loose near the opposition line he always seems to be close at hand. So he catches the eye and it's easy to miss what happens during the gruelling tackling / making yards aspects of the game. But he has plenty of time to develop with a series of teams and coaches. He had a couple of games for Newcastle in 2021 and10 games for Hull in 2022. He started twice with Salford this year, then dropped down to 18th man. I don't think he has played for them since early May.

I can't see how anyone can come to the conclusion that our coaching department has been lacking wrt Longstaff. It's simply a case of a player not quite making the grade. Its unfortunate for both the player and also all the coaches that have spent long hours with him, but its an all too frequent occurrence at youth level.

Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Fri Jul 28, 2023 10:40 am  

Winslade's Offload wrote:

I think this is probably the correct analysis. We got Longstaff when he was dropped from the Wigan Scholarship back in 2019. He is an ex England Youth player and has consistently shown promise during his development. But he doesn't have a big physique and when he played for us he was routinely pushed back when he took the ball up. Yes he is quick, and he is at his best 'poaching' tries. So if there is a break, he will be on the shoulder of the player, and if the ball is loose near the opposition line he always seems to be close at hand. So he catches the eye and it's easy to miss what happens during the gruelling tackling / making yards aspects of the game. But he has plenty of time to develop with a series of teams and coaches. He had a couple of games for Newcastle in 2021 and10 games for Hull in 2022. He started twice with Salford this year, then dropped down to 18th man. I don't think he has played for them since early May.

I can't see how anyone can come to the conclusion that our coaching department has been lacking wrt Longstaff. It's simply a case of a player not quite making the grade. Its unfortunate for both the player and also all the coaches that have spent long hours with him, but its an all too frequent occurrence at youth level.

I'd be interested to hear your views on Conor Wrench & his potential.

Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Fri Jul 28, 2023 11:55 am  

Hill wasn't bad last night was he! Bit old they say. Dudson/Kasiano for another year sounds exciting? What could have been!

Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Fri Jul 28, 2023 1:29 pm  

PEAKEYBLINDER wrote:

Hill wasn't bad last night was he! Bit old they say. Dudson/Kasiano for another year sounds exciting? What could have been!

I thought that myself, best player on the park.

Also think I heard that he has played every game of the season. I might be wrong, but I don’t think we have a single prop/loose that has played every game.

With the benefit of hindsight, that 2 year deal shouldn’t have been a sticking point.

Re: Recruitment rumours and links : Fri Jul 28, 2023 3:10 pm  

Benefit of hindsight really does sway thoughts. I thought Hill looked tired before he left & D.Clark looked as though injuries were catching up with him (this time last year). Mulhern was always a work horse though.
The grass is always greener elsewhere.
Ratchford still kicking goals & throwing some lovely passes but many still think he's past it.
It's not easy making real decisions & attempting to predict the future.