Re: Poor crowd : Sun May 07, 2023 10:03 pm  

Jack Gaskell, you put up a very good argument and I respect your views but I have to differ. No matter what DB does he will find it difficult to get above the 6-7000 average and further down the line this won't be good enough for IMG. They will want 15000+ crowds.

I'm just being realistic. IMG will want big clubs and expansion clubs. This will be later in their 12 year tenure for re-imagining the game, and that is the word you all need to focus on - RE-IMAGINING. By the end of their 12 years Rugby will be totally different. They want a National game and that means mergers and franchises and, as I stated, a possible reunification of the 2 codes.

If IMG want big clubs, it doesn't matter how passionate DB is. What IMG want they will get because they are in it to make money and sentiment definitely doesn't play a part with IMG.

I fear for clubs like Leigh, Cas, Wakey, Huddersfield and maybe HKR and Salford, although they will want a team playing out of Manchester, and I should imagine they will want to keep the Hull derby.

For the next few years you will enjoy a lot of success watching the Leopards, so enjoy it. I've found other things to do with my weekends now so I will never be back with the inflated admission fee.

DB was reported as saying something with the initial rebrand to Leopards. That's what got my alarm bells ringing. I can't remember the exact wording but it hinted that they would be known as the Leopards and so they could be pushed as the Leopards on social media and thus increase their social media following. So, if you build a good following in other parts of the country, the next step is to take a few games on the road to build on that following. Catalans did it when they played Wiggin at the Nou Camp for the record SL attendance. I'm sure a few clubs may try it out just to try and impress IMG.

Re: Poor crowd : Sun May 07, 2023 10:34 pm  

WYSIWYG2 wrote:

Jack Gaskell, you put up a very good argument and I respect your views but I have to differ. No matter what DB does he will find it difficult to get above the 6-7000 average and further down the line this won't be good enough for IMG. They will want 15000+ crowds.

I'm just being realistic. IMG will want big clubs and expansion clubs. This will be later in their 12 year tenure for re-imagining the game, and that is the word you all need to focus on - RE-IMAGINING. By the end of their 12 years Rugby will be totally different. They want a National game and that means mergers and franchises and, as I stated, a possible reunification of the 2 codes.

If IMG want big clubs, it doesn't matter how passionate DB is. What IMG want they will get because they are in it to make money and sentiment definitely doesn't play a part with IMG.

I fear for clubs like Leigh, Cas, Wakey, Huddersfield and maybe HKR and Salford, although they will want a team playing out of Manchester, and I should imagine they will want to keep the Hull derby.

For the next few years you will enjoy a lot of success watching the Leopards, so enjoy it. I've found other things to do with my weekends now so I will never be back with the inflated admission fee.

DB was reported as saying something with the initial rebrand to Leopards. That's what got my alarm bells ringing. I can't remember the exact wording but it hinted that they would be known as the Leopards and so they could be pushed as the Leopards on social media and thus increase their social media following. So, if you build a good following in other parts of the country, the next step is to take a few games on the road to build on that following. Catalans did it when they played Wiggin at the Nou Camp for the record SL attendance. I'm sure a few clubs may try it out just to try and impress IMG.

So you fear for HKR but yet imagine they will still want a Hull derby ! Talking absolute nonsense.
Codes merging? Again absolutely ridiculous statement. That will never ever happen .

Re: Poor crowd : Sun May 07, 2023 11:50 pm  

IMG can want what they like, if the fans don’t like it and vote with there feet and won’t turn up, it turns to custard.

Re: Poor crowd : Mon May 08, 2023 11:39 am  

WYSIWYG2 wrote:

3 wins in the last 3 games and now in the top 6 is a massive achievement of the club and praise should go to all concerned
However, the attendance figures aren't reflecting the team's success on the pitch and the entertainment that is being put on. 6-7000 average is all you will get now at Leigh no matter what you do. 5400 crowd against Cas is poor.
There are a number of factors.

1. The years out of SL has seen the younger supporters lost to Wiggin, Saints, Wire. 2. Friday night games. 3. Pricing.

Good concessions for the younger supporters is bringing the young 'uns back. However, the pricing for away supporters in the Friday night game will deter many from travelling over the M62. I doubt many would attend anyway even if they were Sat/Sun KOs. Yes, you will get good crowds for the local derbies but the Yorkshire fans will think twice. As for myself, the senior concession is way too high at £25 to stand in North Stand and after decades of supporting Leigh through thick and thin, I'm now lost to the game as, I suppose others will be in these tough financial times.

Putting entertainment on is excellent idea, but it doesn't appear to be getting a lot of new supporters in and, I imagine, the extra costs incurred may have been added onto the admission price.

The fact is you can get the kids in, some of whom will bring a parent, but it is going to be very difficult for Leigh to attract many new adult supporters who will follow them every week. We will be stuck at the 6-7000 average and I don't think this will be good enough, some years from now, when IMG will be wanting clubs in SL with 15000+ crowds. That's when IMG will be pushing for mergers and franchises.

I think the teams who IMG will be wanting are:

Wiggin, Saints, Hull, Leeds, Bradford, Catalans, Toulouse, London, Newcastle and then there will be a choice of mergers or be consigned to life outside of SL.

I can even imagine League and Union merging back as one hybrid game in the future to make it a National game. Wiggin v Saracens, Leicester v Leeds, Northampton Saints v St. Helens. It makes sense to me and it will makes sense to IMG and any TV Broadcaster, and I should imagine that will be their goal.

I also think that in the next few seasons DB may take some of Leigh's games on a road trip to an expansion area to test the water for crowd figures and build a following up for the Leopards brand. He won't be happy with 6-7000 average crowd size in Leigh and if he can get a 15000+ crowd in a big city he won't hesitate to move the Leopards.

If you think £25 to watch a SL team currently in the Top 6 in a new stadium with free parking and pre match entertainment is too expensive then I’m afraid you are part of the problem.

The club put on an excellent membership package starting at 20 odd pounds per month including a replica shirt, it’s never been more affordable to watch the team.

Considering our track record in SL is appaling I think our current crowds are very positive, we have never had consecutive years in SL and had time to build a home fan base, now we are relatively safe we can start to build early for next year, that includes preparing next years season ticket offers, signings, sponsorship, corporate, etc etc hopefully incrementally increasing the memberships sold.

The fans that keep trotting ticket prices as an excuse are the fans we need to move away from and attract a new audience, monthly direct debits are available for almost everything these days from car tax to ulitily bills.

I’m also sick of hearing it’s £30 for an away ticket when it clearly isn’t, it’s £27 if bought in advance, unless your that unorganised you can’t manage to buy one until game day.

The atmosphere at games so far has been amazing, the bands have been fantastic, the fireworks, the new sound system, the team flags, the graphics, the videos playing on the big screen, the dancers, the kids waving huge flags has all been brilliant. Other teams/clubs have a responsibility to get away fans to games and add to the spectacle. This is the Pinnacle of the sport, Castleford we’re an embarrassment with their following.

Re: Poor crowd : Mon May 08, 2023 2:53 pm  

£25 is ok when your working but as a concession for seniors it's a non-starter in this economic climate and ridiculous energy bills. I've watched them through thick and thin for decades so I'm not the problem, the concessions for seniors is the problem. If people can't afford it they can't afford it, it doesn't matter if you can pay by direct debit if you haven't got enough to pay the direct debit.

You can all stick your head in the sand but IMG want big clubs with 15000+ crowds. Franchises and mergers will be brought in just as licensing has and yes, at some point in the future the 2 codes will reunite. Both codes are struggling financially and it's the only way to get a National game.

Enjoy the ride because Leigh will have success over the next few years but by the time IMG have finished with their re-imagining only the select few will be in the top league and the smaller clubs won't be in it.

Re: Poor crowd : Mon May 08, 2023 3:47 pm  

WYSIWYG2 wrote:

£25 is ok when your working but as a concession for seniors it's a non-starter in this economic climate and ridiculous energy bills. I've watched them through thick and thin for decades so I'm not the problem, the concessions for seniors is the problem. If people can't afford it they can't afford it, it doesn't matter if you can pay by direct debit if you haven't got enough to pay the direct debit.

You can all stick your head in the sand but IMG want big clubs with 15000+ crowds. Franchises and mergers will be brought in just as licensing has and yes, at some point in the future the 2 codes will reunite. Both codes are struggling financially and it's the only way to get a National game.

Enjoy the ride because Leigh will have success over the next few years but by the time IMG have finished with their re-imagining only the select few will be in the top league and the smaller clubs won't be in it.

How much should a concession ticket be then in you’re opinion?

Re: Poor crowd : Mon May 08, 2023 4:48 pm  

Think I’m right in saying £24 this year as opposed to £17 last ?
Although a £7 increase , 17 last year does seem relatively cheap.
£20/21 May of been a bit fairer but as stated , everything world wide has gone up , so in turn I assume Leighs rent would have increased , extra stewards required not to mention all the extra value from players to entertainment.
Unfortunately some people can go some people can’t , it’s the way of the world . In years gone by I’ve not been in the position to go every game so I picked and chose which I could afford.

Re: Poor crowd : Mon May 08, 2023 5:20 pm  

WYSIWYG2 wrote:

Time will tell but DB has stated that the Leopards are a brand, which means they can play anywhere not just in their hometown. DB has eventually done wonders at Leigh but he is a businessman and if there are bigger crowd opportunities elsewhere that's where the Leopards will play some games. The city of Manchester is right on our doorstep so it wouldn't surprise me that, in the future, DB will try to expand the brand there after he has turned the Leopards into a successful brand. This was his whole point of rebranding the club. Centurions were synonymous with failure. Leopards will be synonymous with success. If Tescos can only pull 6000 customers in Leigh but can attract over 15000 customers in Manchester then it's obvious they will make more money in Manchester and Manchester will be their focus. It's the same with the Leopards as a business and DB is a very successful businessman. Sentiment doesn't come into business decisions. A successful international business is running the game now and IMG call the shots. If they advocate franchising and mergers, then that's what it will be. Whoever thought licensing would be accepted again yet the clubs voted overwhelmingly for licensing.

It isn't going to happen overnight but it will happen.

You change the brand to raise the profile of the club. Leigh don’t have a ground bought by Tescos, wire do.
You will never see a merger at Leigh. The club would die first.

Re: Poor crowd : Fri May 12, 2023 12:53 am  

The opportunity for Leigh to 'grow' their brand will be the last game of the season v Wigan. Would be even better if we had still something to play for.

I would play it at Bolton. It would generate a great crowd and would tap into outer areas like Westhoughton, Horwich, Daisy Hill, Bents, Bongs and a huge Town like Bolton itself.

Wigan would bring double to Bolton for sure !

Re: Poor crowd : Fri May 12, 2023 3:39 pm  

Always great to get more fans in but we are doing better than some others given town size ie Hudds, Salford, Waky. With another year in SL [fingers crossed] gives us opportunity to reach further than just the Leigh boundary, marketing to towns adjacent would add 40k of potential fans base. Just 10% of these gives us around 10k+ per match. Think the challenge from IMG is growing fans bases if we start filling grounds in the heartlands this creates more interest for TV and attract new team start ups in other areas.