Re: Tomorrow? : Thu Oct 26, 2023 9:31 pm  

In all honesty, I think as a club, we have fulfilled quite a lot of expectancy in rugby league to dine at the top table. I also think that the silence from the club shows this, and it seems (at the moment) that Degsey isn't perturbed by this circus from the clowns at IMG.

Re: Tomorrow? : Fri Oct 27, 2023 1:12 pm  

Tipster Ste wrote:

i have no idea mate the only thing they should outside us on is community - based off the bullshit criteria

do we possibly lose partial point because we are one of two teams in our borough french aint

we would possibly lose portion on performance over last 3 years community another one? fines? non centralised turnover
what is the big number?

Re: Tomorrow? : Fri Oct 27, 2023 7:48 pm  

Mr Mills, good evening, hope you are well?

Kindly rephrase those questions that Bongser may grasp them.

Not TTP just struggling to understand your post - unusually as they are normally clear.

Re: Tomorrow? : Sat Oct 28, 2023 5:29 pm  

With the absence of any concrete figures for the Leigh Leopards, I thought that I would delve into the B rankings and see what I could find.

There are 7 A rated clubs, so from a Leigh perspective we can ignore them, because under the mock exams they all passed and are therefore exempt from relegation. 8-14 is were the real action is happening and there is a natural gap between these 7 groups and Featherstone and Widnes. Castleford have now had a recount approved, pushing Leigh into the relegation zone.

8. Salford Red Devils – B – 13.80 – Super League
9. Huddersfield Giants – B – 13.49 – Super League
10. Toulouse Olympique – B – 12.97 – Championship
11. Castleford Tigers – B – 12.91 – Super League
12. Wakefield Trinity – B – 12.52 – Championship
13. Leigh Leopards – B – 12.45 – Super League
14. Bradford Bulls – B – 12.02 – Championship

Previously mentioned are the results for Salford and Bradford, which give a reasonable indication of where the points were gained and lost. Leigh are more similar to Salford than Bradford so I will concentrate on their figures.
Salford's scorecard:

Performance – 3.43 points from 5
Fandom – 4.15 points from 5
Finances – 2.15 from 4.5
Stadium – 1.83 from 3
Community – 2.25 from 2.5

Performance – Max Points - 5
Each season all clubs in Tiers 1-3 (Men’s only) are ranked 1-36 based on their final league positions each season i.e. after all matches have been played in each season.
The season league rankings are calculated over the last three seasons
2023 – Salford 7th (3.3333) – Leigh 5th + Challenge Cup (3.5556) + (0.25) = (3.8056)
2022 – Salford 6th (3.4444) – Leigh 13th (2.6667)
2021 – Salford 11th (2.8889) – Leigh 12th (2.7778)
Average Score: Salford - 3.2222 (Actual Salford score 3.43) Leigh - 3.0833 or (3.000 + 025) – (3.2500) Depending on whether the Challenge Cup is averaged over 3 years or not.
Roughly speaking performance over the 3 years Salford are 7th and Leigh 11th.

Fandom – Max Points – 5
Attendance – Average over the last 3 years

2023 achieved 8th spot in the average attendance for the season, including a new record against Wigan (sell out) stadium restricted with the stage for bands.
8. Leigh Leopards – 7,254; Highest: 10,308 v Wigan (R27); Lowest: 5,423 v Castleford (R11)

Salford – 3 years in Super league >3000 – worth 2 points
Leigh – 2 years in Super League >3000 – worth 2 points

Viewership – Average over the last 3 years - >150K = 1 and <150K = 0.75
Salford – 1 point
Leigh – 0.75

Digital – Social Following – Website Visits – Total Engagements
Maximum score – 1.5 and minimum score – 0.33
Salford scored 1.15
Leigh – best guess 0.625

Totals
Salford 4.15
Leigh – 3.375

Finances – 4.5 (Overall Weighting 22.5%) – 3 year average
Absolutely no idea, but as an outsider Salford are a community club with no debts and no money (selling club) Leigh have a benefactor but no stability outside of the owner.
Maximum score 4.5 and minimum 1.40
Salford scored 2.15
Leigh probably scored around the same 2.15

Stadium – 3 (Overall Weighting 15%)
Facilities – 1.5
Salford 1.5
Leigh 1.5
Utilisation – 1
Salford - 0.2
Leigh - 0.2
Primacy of Tenure – 0.25
Salford 0
Leigh - 0
LED – 0.125
Salford - 0.125
Leigh - 0.125
Big Screen – 0.125
Salford - 0.125
Leigh - 0.125

Salford scored 1.83
Leigh best guess 1.83

Community 2.5 (Overall Weighting 15%)
Catchment – 1.5
Salford – 1.5
Leigh – 1

Foundation – 1
Salford – 0.75
Leigh – 0.75

Salford – 2.25
Leigh – 2.0

Summary

This is a best guess as to how the points are distributed. Some fields are nailed on certainties and others are comparisons to Salford and an attempt to reach the final scores published

Salford Leigh
Performance 3.43 3.1
Fandom 4.15 3.375
Finances 2.15 2.15
Stadium 1.83 1.83
Community 2.25 2
13.81 12.455

In my opinion a good season in 2024 will raise the score, but we lose 0.25 unless Leigh can win the Challenge Cup again.

There are no addition points to be gained from Stadium and Community, so the big areas of gain must come from Fandom and Finances. There are 0.5 points available if the Average attendance is >7500 but that is unlikely due to 1 of the years being in the championship.

Gains can be made from improving merchandising and hopefully Patrick is a step in the right direction and the website is now able to accommodate E-commerce. Stories abound of people being unable to buy replica shirts and around the time of Challenge Cup the stall on the market was an empty cupboard.

The biggest single area of improvement is Digital Scoring. This does not appear to have a 3 year average. This means that improvements in the next 12 months will have a direct impact. A possible 0.9 is available if the digital team can start to develop some content across Facebook, Instagram and the Leopards website.

Re: Tomorrow? : Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:38 pm  

Did you have the day off today, Sep? Bongser did not - and missed the Second Test as a result (dead rubber coming up, hope Wane bloods Mulhern).

Day off tomorrow during which Bongser will try to assimilate your thunkings - for tonight we drink!

Re: Tomorrow? : Tue Oct 31, 2023 6:27 pm  

From TRL just to save using up your searches for the week -
IN case you had been living under a rock, you will have realised that IMG released their provisional grades for all 36 professional clubs.
From Leeds Rhinos right down to the North Wales Crusaders, 36 clubs were placed in a table with points calculated from five different categories – fandom (5), performance (5), finance (4.5), stadium (3) and community (2.5).
Whilst the overwhelming majority of clubs decided not to broadcast the breakdown of those IMG points – which saw all 36 clubs scored out of 20 – a number of them did. Here are those:
Barrow Raiders – 19th – 9.18 points
Performance – 1.48/5
Fandom – 3.25/5
Finance – 2.25/4.5
Stadium – 1.19/3
Community – 1/2.5

Bradford Bulls – 14th – 12.02 points
Performance – 2.17/5
Fandom – 3.95/5
Finance – 2.75/4.5
Stadium – 0.89/3
Community – 2.25/2.5

Castleford Tigers – 11th – 12.91 points (revised data following information given on Castleford website)
Performance – 3.09/5
Fandom – 4.20/5
Finance – 3.05/4.5
Stadium – 1.32/3
Community – 1.25/2.5

Hunslet RLFC – 29th – 6.94 points
Performance – 0.46/5
Fandom – 2.05/5
Finances – 1.75/4.5
Stadium – 0.68/3
Community – 2.00/2.5

Salford Red Devils – 8th – 13.80 points
Performance – 3.43/5
Fandom – 4.15/5
Finances – 2.15/4.5
Stadium – 1.83/3
Community – 2.25/2.5

Re: Tomorrow? : Fri Nov 03, 2023 10:46 am  

Septimius Severus wrote: From TRL just to save using up your searches for the week - IN case you had been living under a rock, you will have realised that IMG released their provisional grades for all 36 professional clubs. From Leeds Rhinos right down to the North Wales Crusaders, 36 clubs were placed in a table with points calculated from five different categories – fandom (5), performance (5), finance (4.5), stadium (3) and community (2.5). Whilst the overwhelming majority of clubs decided not to broadcast the breakdown of those IMG points – which saw all 36 clubs scored out of 20 – a number of them did. Here are those: Barrow Raiders – 19th – 9.18 points Performance – 1.48/5 Fandom – 3.25/5 Finance – 2.25/4.5 Stadium – 1.19/3 Community – 1/2.5 Bradford Bulls – 14th – 12.02 points Performance – 2.17/5 Fandom – 3.95/5 Finance – 2.75/4.5 Stadium – 0.89/3 Community – 2.25/2.5 Castleford Tigers – 11th – 12.91 points (revised data following information given on Castleford website) Performance – 3.09/5 Fandom – 4.20/5 Finance – 3.05/4.5 Stadium – 1.32/3 Community – 1.25/2.5 Hunslet RLFC – 29th – 6.94 points Performance – 0.46/5 Fandom – 2.05/5 Finances – 1.75/4.5 Stadium – 0.68/3 Community – 2.00/2.5 Salford Red Devils – 8th – 13.80 points Performance – 3.43/5 Fandom – 4.15/5 Finances – 2.15/4.5 Stadium – 1.83/3 Community – 2.25/2.5 Well in the interest of stated openness I did ask.Maybe our owner will tell us. Thank you for your email, we appreciate your feedback. At present the RFL is responsible for publishing clubs' overall grades, while publication of itemised category scores is a matter for individual clubs. However, this position is under consideration. If you would like to read more about the IMG Grading Criteria, please see the link below. https://www.rugby-league.com/governance ... nd-reports Kind Regards, Enquiries​ Enquiries@RLcommercial.co.uk

Septimius Severus wrote: From TRL just to save using up your searches for the week - IN case you had been living under a rock, you will have realised that IMG released their provisional grades for all 36 professional clubs. From Leeds Rhinos right down to the North Wales Crusaders, 36 clubs were placed in a table with points calculated from five different categories – fandom (5), performance (5), finance (4.5), stadium (3) and community (2.5). Whilst the overwhelming majority of clubs decided not to broadcast the breakdown of those IMG points – which saw all 36 clubs scored out of 20 – a number of them did. Here are those: Barrow Raiders – 19th – 9.18 points Performance – 1.48/5 Fandom – 3.25/5 Finance – 2.25/4.5 Stadium – 1.19/3 Community – 1/2.5 Bradford Bulls – 14th – 12.02 points Performance – 2.17/5 Fandom – 3.95/5 Finance – 2.75/4.5 Stadium – 0.89/3 Community – 2.25/2.5 Castleford Tigers – 11th – 12.91 points (revised data following information given on Castleford website) Performance – 3.09/5 Fandom – 4.20/5 Finance – 3.05/4.5 Stadium – 1.32/3 Community – 1.25/2.5 Hunslet RLFC – 29th – 6.94 points Performance – 0.46/5 Fandom – 2.05/5 Finances – 1.75/4.5 Stadium – 0.68/3 Community – 2.00/2.5 Salford Red Devils – 8th – 13.80 points Performance – 3.43/5 Fandom – 4.15/5 Finances – 2.15/4.5 Stadium – 1.83/3 Community – 2.25/2.5 Well in the interest of stated openness I did ask.Maybe our owner will tell us. Thank you for your email, we appreciate your feedback. At present the RFL is responsible for publishing clubs' overall grades, while publication of itemised category scores is a matter for individual clubs. However, this position is under consideration. If you would like to read more about the IMG Grading Criteria, please see the link below. https://www.rugby-league.com/governance ... nd-reports Kind Regards, Enquiries​ Enquiries@RLcommercial.co.uk

Re: Tomorrow? : Fri Nov 03, 2023 4:11 pm  

Unless there's a rabbit to pull out of the hat with the financials and community foundation, then we won't be in Super League in 2025.

Re: Tomorrow? : Fri Dec 01, 2023 11:18 pm  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cPlin5uClM If you don't want to watch, the answer is quite simple - The finance can be manipulated, with Owner loans and levels of finance that can be moved around. Leigh scored rock bottom in this field and will gain another 3 points when manipulated, achieving the magical 15 points and a Grade A licence.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cPlin5uClM If you don't want to watch, the answer is quite simple - The finance can be manipulated, with Owner loans and levels of finance that can be moved around. Leigh scored rock bottom in this field and will gain another 3 points when manipulated, achieving the magical 15 points and a Grade A licence.

Re: Tomorrow? : Sat Dec 02, 2023 3:16 am  

The interview you link Sep is well worth a listen. But if you ever doubted if Derek was a smart guy, then it an almost must listen. In the area of finances, he explains that he deliberately left club finances relatively unaltered for the initial trial IMG gradings, to see where things fell out. Now he knows exactly how IMG are assessing the various areas of finances (and in relative relation to other areas) he will (not may, be can/will) make the necessary changes to drastically boost our club financial score in the 3.0 range increase that Sep mentions. He also talks about another couple of other minor changes that we can make in other areas that will boost us above the magic 15.0 grade A score. A listen will tell you, this is not a maybe on his part, but a very confident “will” happen.
Another good reason to listen is to hear how committed he is to Leigh Leopards being in Leigh going forward. He talks about how we can be a club that can become a bigger draw on the big stage and garner even more supporters from outside our current perceived catchment area, and how that makes the catchment area a redundant grading criteria that he believes will disappear in 2025.
One last reason to listen is the fact ghat he mentions we have another significant signing in the works. The way he talks about it, if it happens, it will be a signing that will improve our current starting lineup, not just a squad boosting level player.
There are no guarantees in life or sport, but I am 100% confident that Derek is in this for the long haul, has zero desire to sell the club on at a profit or move it for profitable driven reasons, and will do whatever it takes to get us into not just Grade A status but make us one of the perennial top contenders moving forward.
I’ve been an active Leyther supporter for 55 years and I have never felt this bouyant about our clubs future