: Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:04 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

A bit like Saints then.
Goulding, Newlove, Sculthorpe, , Sullivan, Nickle, Martyn, Joynt, Gibbs, tec

and now Gidley, Meli, Pryce, Gilmour, Long, Hargreaves, etc

There were as many players who started their careers in Wigan academy in the Saints starting 13 as players who stared at Saints.

And an ex Rugby Union player on Saints bench.

Ask some of the older generation fans should Saints ever have signed Tomy Voll, Len Killeen etc and tell them you think it was a bad idea.

Offiah, Lydon, Miles, Bell, Gregory, Platt, Hanley, Connolly, Preston, Gill, Goodway, Hampson, Botica, Roberts, West, Du Toit , Loew, Mcginty to name a few who Wigan bought in from elsewhere.

You see what i am saying is that in the past big clubs like Wigan and Saints spent as much nicking players from other clubs and RU as they did bringing through their own talent. This needs to change for us to compete with the Aussies and grow the game in the UK.

Saints have under McMannus changed their philosophy to one of developing a top class team made up of players developed at Saints from their youth set up, and only buying top class Australasian talent where there is a perceived shortfall in quality or experience.

Wigan have as yet not managed to overcome their historical cultural legacy of buying success and are obsessed with populating their team with "signings".
Leeds have however under Hetherington changed the Leeds set up from one of buying to one of building and its paid big dividends for them.

The frustration many Wigan fans are starting to now feel over Nobles perceived disregard for talented Wigan juniors, is a sign that the new generation of Wigan fans are learning the lesson that the best way for the club to regain its former status is to build from within.


While a small number of RU players such as Boston and Vollenhoven became legends within RL, the vast majority were quite frankly a waste of money, that could have been better spent finding our own Boston or Vollenhoven from within the game itself.
The fact the game didnt bother doing this is one of the reasons why by 1995 after 100 years in existence the game was still only played in parts of Lancashire and Yorkshire within the UK, and why ultimately we have been unable to compete with Australia over the last 30 or so years.

There is also the 800 pound Gorilla in the corner called professional RU which is far richer than RL, and makes the signing of home nations RU players mere fantasy.

[DaveO]

: Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:14 pm  

post wrote:

I think the idea is a great one about bringing in RU players and only having say 50k counted on the cap from whatever they earn, just one per team, cracking idea

If there are going to be dispensations on the salary cap for any players shouldn't it be for those who have come through a sides own junior ranks?

If the sport went for union mega starts and offered them £300K (which is the sort of figure they can earn in RU) but only £150K counted on the cap what do you think this would do for RL players have who worked at the game and got to the peak of it who only get £150K in their pocket?

It is a stupid ill though out and divisive idea.

Dave

: Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:16 pm  

The Chair Maker wrote:

Saints have under McMannus changed their philosophy to one of developing a top class team made up of players developed at Saints from their youth set up, and only buying top class Australasian talent where there is a perceived shortfall in quality or experience.

So how does that equate with Saints having one of the oldest starting squads in Superleague?

[Wigan6/Leeds1 Andy]

: Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:20 pm  

Further proof (if any were needed) that Noble's stuck in some 20 year timewarp. Brian - RU went professional a while back, and anybody worth getting we couldn't afford now.

: Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:25 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

So how does that equate with Saints having one of the oldest starting squads in Superleague?

Nicely worded Rogues

: Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:38 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

So how does that equate with Saints having one of the oldest starting squads in Superleague?

Selective statistical interpretation on your part.

[DaveO]

: Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:40 pm  

The Chair Maker wrote:

Offiah, Lydon, Miles, Bell, Gregory, Platt, Hanley, Connolly, Preston, Gill, Goodway, Hampson, Botica, Roberts, West, Du Toit , Loew, Mcginty to name a few who Wigan bought in from elsewhere.

Hampson started his RU career at Wigan from a second string RU side - Vulcan. Preston also came from an RU side. Forget which one but neither were poached of a top flight RU club.

You see what i am saying is that in the past big clubs like Wigan and Saints spent as much nicking players from other clubs and RU as they did bringing through their own talent. This needs to change for us to compete with the Aussies and grow the game in the UK.

Wigan brought through plenty of home grown players through like Goulding, Wane, Dermott, Edwards, Betts, Ckarke and so on during that era.

It was a mix of home grown, bought in players and a few quality imports.

To suggest the Wigan teams of the 80's and 90's relied on buying in talent is a joke. The club has always produced a lot of its own players.

I'd suggest during that period Saints had more home grown players in its ranks than it has had recently as well.

Saints have under McMannus changed their philosophy to one of developing a top class team made up of players developed at Saints from their youth set up, and only buying top class Australasian talent where there is a perceived shortfall in quality or experience.

Don't talk rubbish. Your trophy winning sides of the SL era were built almost entirely on bought in players.

Wigan have as yet not managed to overcome their historical cultural legacy of buying success and are obsessed with populating their team with "signings".

Are you for real? Your teams of the past few years were based almost entirely on signings.

The frustration many Wigan fans are starting to now feel over Nobles perceived disregard for talented Wigan juniors, is a sign that the new generation of Wigan fans are learning the lesson that the best way for the club to regain its former status is to build from within.

It always was! The successful sides were always built on a core of home grown players with some astute signings both from the UK and overseas. In contrast to Saints recent teams where they were built on signings a about three home grown players.

Dave

: Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:46 pm  

The Chair Maker wrote:

Selective statistical interpretation on your part.

Just take the first choice Saints 17, that's still one of the oldest in Superleague.

: Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:56 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

Just take the first choice Saints 17, that's still one of the oldest in Superleague.

Starting 13 from Friday

Saints - 27
Wigan - 25

Not that much difference.

: Sun Feb 15, 2009 5:03 pm  

Rogues Gallery wrote:

So how does that equate with Saints having one of the oldest starting squads in Superleague?

Because most of those 'old' players have been there since they got there chance as youngsters.