Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Fri Dec 23, 2022 8:40 pm  

jonh wrote:

MadDogg wrote:

Singleton was very good at times last year - when he plays with intensity he's a real asset.

If Bateman leaves and all the rumours about players coming in come to nothing I don't think it's the end of the world. There is enough 2nd row cover to get by and recruitment opportunities tend to crop up mid season.

Agree good players usually become available mid season.

The issue being most of them tend to be non quota. A luxury we don’t currently have an allowance for.

Very rare a top player goes to a SL rival mid season.

I accept Cooper did but that was thanks to agent Powell and is the exception rather than the rule.

Good point - comes back to the issue of wasting a quota spot on Isa - I couldn't believe his contract extension this time last year.

Can't see him being released mid contract for some reason although I think it would be our best move re the quota. Think it'll be either Miski or Mago if we intend to open up a spot for someone but there are downsides to releasing either. Miski is a good option on the wing either as a back up or to take Bevan's place if we decide to move him to full back. Mago looks in better shape in the pre season pictures Iv seen - it would be interesting to see how he'll go in 2023.

Ultimately though I'd be surprised if Bateman leaves and no-one comes in prior to the season start. I don't see a viable English replacement outside of Thompson and unfortunately can see him ending up at St Helens in 2024 to replace LMS.

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Fri Dec 23, 2022 11:25 pm  

We will be OK at prop, we could do with a real class prop I'll grant you but what team wouldn't? We should be getting more from Cooper, Ellis and Mago as they settle in, Byrne and Havard kicking on with maybe one of the Academy props filling in well.
If Batman goes then we are very thin in the 2nd row, especially at the start of the season with Faz out and Nsemba further from being ready than he will be at seasons end.

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:07 am  

sergeant pepper wrote:

jonh wrote:

sergeant pepper wrote:

Apart from some potential depth, we don't need anyone in the backrow.

Faz = best 2nd row in the comp
Smithies was outstanding last year and it was criminal Wane left him out of the WC. I hate to see us move him for anyone - make him VC and give him the 13 shirt.
KPP = one of the games most sought after prospects.
Isa and Nesmba as a backup.

Props an issue however. Singleton, regardless of what people say on here, is one of the worst props in the game. It's criminal he's even a pro, nevermind a Wigan player. Mago, seems well liked, but doesn't seem to trusted or able to do big mins either.

Under that scenario you are expecting either Isa or Nsemba to be a key part of the 17 every week.

Isa is a warrior but I would not be comfortable with him in the 17 every week. Asking a kid with bags of potential to step forward into that role could very well destroy his career.

Singleton I rate he is the throwback we lacked for so long who may not do the eye catching stuff but puts his head where others don’t.

Mago needs to offer more consistency.

I'd happily see us share that role between Isa and Nesemba.

That line about Singleton is one of those myths that gets rolled out when people talk about him. It's one of the RL'isms and the opposite to when a player is labelled as 'soft'. In the real world, his stats are dire and we struggle to get on top, when he's on the pitch. It's why we signed Cooper i.e the player we thought we'd got with Cooper.

Just following up on the “dire stats” and as I’m a bit of a stickler for such things and if you are sad enough to actually spend 40 minutes analysing the stats of all our props from last year it makes very interesting reading.

Based on the following criteria over the course of the season -

Average gain, marker tackles, offloads, tackle busts, tackles, penalties, missed tackles and errors.

Singleton shows up pretty well. Probably our 3rd most influential prop in the squad statistically, 5th best from an attacking point of view but just first on defence and the first and second are a long way of the rest in the defensive department.

What was also interesting statistically is the fact Ellis is probably our number one prop over the course of the season and perhaps why the coaches speak so highly of him.

We have on our books next year Cooper, Singleton, Byrne, Havard, Mago, Ellis as front line props. We also have Smithies who has moved forward into that position at times very well last year and Hill coming through who made the England Knights squad.

If Bateman goes I’m more convinced than ever we need to replace him with either a like for like or a “middle”.

It’s also interesting that you seem to be pushing Nsemba over Hill as a first team prospect in 23 over Hill an England Knights player.

Like I said though interested to understand why Singletons stats are “dire”.

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Mon Dec 26, 2022 6:00 am  

Bateman signed for Wests, immediate effect, no replacement incoming

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Mon Dec 26, 2022 6:11 am  

TheWarringtonWolve69 wrote:

NickyKiss wrote:

Looks like Toby Brannan has joined Ben O’Keefe at Rochdale on a permanent deal. Guys like Halsall, Bibby, Hanley, Nicholson and McDonnell already gone as well. There definitely looks to be a change in tact in terms of carrying a deep squad.

The reserve team from last year has been broken up to a degree, with us seemingly picking out who they consider the better ones (Hill, Nsemba, Forber, Astley and Eckersley) and pumping more money in to having a stronger top 17-20. Happy enough if they want to do that but if we keep losing English players like Bateman and KPP, it’s going to be tough to keep juggling things like the overseas quota and how you dip the younger players in.

Remember when I told you all neither Thompson nor Pryce will be at Wigan next season? And I was right? Here’s another. Bateman will be at Wigan next season.

You will see

This aged well. Another pearl of wisdom from LeBron

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Mon Dec 26, 2022 9:53 am  

[Gareth] wrote:

TheWarringtonWolve69 wrote:

NickyKiss wrote:

Looks like Toby Brannan has joined Ben O’Keefe at Rochdale on a permanent deal. Guys like Halsall, Bibby, Hanley, Nicholson and McDonnell already gone as well. There definitely looks to be a change in tact in terms of carrying a deep squad.

The reserve team from last year has been broken up to a degree, with us seemingly picking out who they consider the better ones (Hill, Nsemba, Forber, Astley and Eckersley) and pumping more money in to having a stronger top 17-20. Happy enough if they want to do that but if we keep losing English players like Bateman and KPP, it’s going to be tough to keep juggling things like the overseas quota and how you dip the younger players in.

Remember when I told you all neither Thompson nor Pryce will be at Wigan next season? And I was right? Here’s another. Bateman will be at Wigan next season.

You will see

This aged well. Another pearl of wisdom from LeBron

It was a 50/50 shot. Better luck next time

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Mon Dec 26, 2022 9:57 am  

jonh wrote:

sergeant pepper wrote:

jonh wrote:

sergeant pepper wrote:

Apart from some potential depth, we don't need anyone in the backrow.

Faz = best 2nd row in the comp
Smithies was outstanding last year and it was criminal Wane left him out of the WC. I hate to see us move him for anyone - make him VC and give him the 13 shirt.
KPP = one of the games most sought after prospects.
Isa and Nesmba as a backup.

Props an issue however. Singleton, regardless of what people say on here, is one of the worst props in the game. It's criminal he's even a pro, nevermind a Wigan player. Mago, seems well liked, but doesn't seem to trusted or able to do big mins either.

Under that scenario you are expecting either Isa or Nsemba to be a key part of the 17 every week.

Isa is a warrior but I would not be comfortable with him in the 17 every week. Asking a kid with bags of potential to step forward into that role could very well destroy his career.

Singleton I rate he is the throwback we lacked for so long who may not do the eye catching stuff but puts his head where others don’t.

Mago needs to offer more consistency.

I'd happily see us share that role between Isa and Nesemba.

That line about Singleton is one of those myths that gets rolled out when people talk about him. It's one of the RL'isms and the opposite to when a player is labelled as 'soft'. In the real world, his stats are dire and we struggle to get on top, when he's on the pitch. It's why we signed Cooper i.e the player we thought we'd got with Cooper.

Just following up on the “dire stats” and as I’m a bit of a stickler for such things and if you are sad enough to actually spend 40 minutes analysing the stats of all our props from last year it makes very interesting reading.

Based on the following criteria over the course of the season -

Average gain, marker tackles, offloads, tackle busts, tackles, penalties, missed tackles and errors.

Singleton shows up pretty well. Probably our 3rd most influential prop in the squad statistically, 5th best from an attacking point of view but just first on defence and the first and second are a long way of the rest in the defensive department.

What was also interesting statistically is the fact Ellis is probably our number one prop over the course of the season and perhaps why the coaches speak so highly of him.

We have on our books next year Cooper, Singleton, Byrne, Havard, Mago, Ellis as front line props. We also have Smithies who has moved forward into that position at times very well last year and Hill coming through who made the England Knights squad.

If Bateman goes I’m more convinced than ever we need to replace him with either a like for like or a “middle”.

It’s also interesting that you seem to be pushing Nsemba over Hill as a first team prospect in 23 over Hill an England Knights player.

Like I said though interested to understand why Singletons stats are “dire”.

Interesting stuff on Singo and Ellis.

Its possibly easier to transition a 2nd row into the team than a prop and now that Batman has been confirmed Nsemba will get game time. That Hill is being pushed forward shows what great potential he has.

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Mon Dec 26, 2022 10:02 am  

apollosghost wrote:

Bateman signed for Wests, immediate effect, no replacement incoming

No replacement is the disappointing thing. Bateman has treated the club appallingly after being looked after when he wanted to come back the first time. Leaves a bad taste. Hope he fails spectacularly

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Mon Dec 26, 2022 12:34 pm  

TheWarringtonWolve69 wrote:

NickyKiss wrote:

Looks like Toby Brannan has joined Ben O’Keefe at Rochdale on a permanent deal. Guys like Halsall, Bibby, Hanley, Nicholson and McDonnell already gone as well. There definitely looks to be a change in tact in terms of carrying a deep squad.

The reserve team from last year has been broken up to a degree, with us seemingly picking out who they consider the better ones (Hill, Nsemba, Forber, Astley and Eckersley) and pumping more money in to having a stronger top 17-20. Happy enough if they want to do that but if we keep losing English players like Bateman and KPP, it’s going to be tough to keep juggling things like the overseas quota and how you dip the younger players in.

Remember when I told you all neither Thompson nor Pryce will be at Wigan next season? And I was right? Here’s another. Bateman will be at Wigan next season.

You will see

We saw,you was wrong (again)

Re: Rumours and signings v9 : Mon Dec 26, 2022 12:55 pm  

I’ve got absolutely no issue with Bateman leaving, but the club trying to make out that Isa moving back to his preferred position, is an adequate substitute for a marquee player, is absolutely laughable. Very frustrating!