Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sun Aug 25, 2024 12:06 pm  

LewCharnock wrote:

Some of Saints senior players need to have a look in the mirror, those young lads were hung out to dry yesterday.

Hull KR were outstanding, their biggest issue is that GF isn’t next week, as I don’t think anyone is beating them currently on this form. 7 weeks is a long time in sport, for everyone (including Saints!) to build for Old Trafford.

The rugby barometer will tell us how good they are in a fortnight when they come to Wigan.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sun Aug 25, 2024 12:44 pm  

Phuzzy wrote:

Mate, with all due respect, that's utter nonsense. 50% of tacklers do not leave the ground with both feet! You're just making things up. Of the small minority of tackles where the player's feet do leave the ground, only the ones that make direct contact with the head are punished. If Makinson hadn't made contact with the head, he wouldn't have been punished either. Unfortunately for him, he quite clearly did. You say he tried to wrap his arms. You mean like Byrne on Good Friday? Remind me what happened there?

It was a straight red. Absolutely no doubt whatsoever about it.

The rest of your post is an entirely different discussion.

Let's not start pretending that whether or not a player's feet leave the ground is now some kind of criterion for a red card. Please, let's nip this imaginary problem in the bud before it becomes another millstone round the game's neck.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sun Aug 25, 2024 1:20 pm  

Cruncher wrote:

Let's not start pretending that whether or not a player's feet leave the ground is now some kind of criterion for a red card. Please, let's nip this imaginary problem in the bud before it becomes another millstone round the game's neck.

I you are out of control both feet off the floor and make direct contact with the head when the opponent hasn’t lowered his head or dropped height at speed it has to be red.

As far as I know any reckless contact with the head has always been red, difference in this case from others was perhaps the intention to do damage….which I don’t think there was in this case.

I do though think the tackle was made out of pure frustration and if Saints are not getting pumped I don’t personally think TM performs the tackle in the same way.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sun Aug 25, 2024 5:53 pm  

Cruncher wrote:

Let's not start pretending that whether or not a player's feet leave the ground is now some kind of criterion for a red card. Please, let's nip this imaginary problem in the bud before it becomes another millstone round the game's neck.

It is if he's bolt upright and makes direct contact with the head as it means there's no attempt to keep the tackle low! I can only imagine you're being deliberately obtuse if you can't see a player jumping into a tackle is more likely to lead to a high tackle. Or do you think a defender who lowers his tackle height by bending his back is equally likely to hit the attacker high?

Come on mate, use a bit of sense. I understand you don't like the rule but trying to argue that an upright player with both feet off the ground isn't higher than an upright player with both feet on the ground is bordering on the delusional.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sun Aug 25, 2024 10:40 pm  

Phuzzy wrote:

It is if he's bolt upright and makes direct contact with the head as it means there's no attempt to keep the tackle low! I can only imagine you're being deliberately obtuse if you can't see a player jumping into a tackle is more likely to lead to a high tackle. Or do you think a defender who lowers his tackle height by bending his back is equally likely to hit the attacker high?

Come on mate, use a bit of sense. I understand you don't like the rule but trying to argue that an upright player with both feet off the ground isn't higher than an upright player with both feet on the ground is bordering on the delusional.

There's nothing delusional in being worried about the way the game is going.

If you're absolutely 100% okay that any contact with the head should be classifiable as a head-shot and merit some kind of card, then fine. I personally think it'll ruin the game I grew up loving (in fact, I think it already is - fans pay good money to watch stars on the pitch, not sitting in the stand, suffering draconian punishments for 'offences' which in a contact sport are commonplace and often accidental). But each to their own. At least you're in synch with the current powers-that-be.

No doubt you'll want the final word. Fine. have it. I've said what I think and am done with it.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sun Aug 25, 2024 10:42 pm  

Cruncher wrote:

There's nothing delusional in being worried about the way the game is going.

If you're absolutely 100% okay that any contact with the head should be classifiable as a head-shot and merit some kind of card, then fine. I personally think it'll ruin the game I grew up loving (in fact, I think it already is - fans pay good money to watch stars on the pitch, not sitting in the stand, suffering draconian punishments for 'offences' which in a contact sport are commonplace and often accidental). But each to their own. At least you're in synch with the current powers-that-be.

No doubt you'll want the final word. Fine. have it. I've said what I think and am done with it.

Woah! This is a completely different discussion to "it was never a red card" or whether being off the ground makes a high shot more likely. Whether you like the fact that it is a red card or not is irrelevant. I said previously that I understand that you don't. I can't say I'm keen myself but understand the thinking behind the new rules (if not always the interpretation).

Just to clarify my posts. You said it was never a red card. I said it was. That's the entirety of the debate as far as I'm concerned. If you want to discuss whether the rules are good for the game, necessary or anything else I'm more than happy to chat about that too but that's nothing to do with my posts on the subject to date.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Mon Aug 26, 2024 8:22 am  

As it stands by the rules it was a red and Tommy prob will get a 2 match ban to clarify it.
We may not like the way the game is going sometimes but these are the rules at the min.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Mon Aug 26, 2024 10:40 am  

There was probably more damage long term at our game yesterday with two accidental head clashes caused by their own team mate than most red & yellow offences this season. Both looked awful (especially the Hull FC one in slow motion with a head to the bridge of his nose).

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Mon Aug 26, 2024 10:59 am  

MattyB wrote:

There was probably more damage long term at our game yesterday with two accidental head clashes caused by their own team mate than most red & yellow offences this season. Both looked awful (especially the Hull FC one in slow motion with a head to the bridge of his nose).

and there'll be no sanctions fines suspensions because 4 defenders crashed into each other, accidents happen in a contact sport, this afternoon a defender will probably get a ban because they accidentally made contact with an attackers head, makes no sense.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Mon Aug 26, 2024 3:22 pm  

I didn't really like the red card and thought it was a bit silly (Tommy went front on with his chest, wrapped his arms etc and the ref just decided to stop the game himself for no reason despite May wanting to play on) however, with the rules the way they are at the minute, I understood that it's technically correct.

Being banned for 3 games for it though is disgrace. Cannot loving stand the MRP, they are ruining the game completely