: Thu Feb 26, 2009 5:46 pm  

i may be wrong but it seems because SBW is unhappy in union people are assuming Gasnier and Ashton are without any basis for this. Not seen Gasnier play but from what i have seen of Ashton he looks to be enjoying his rugby at Northampton.

I think more often than not the unhappy in union rumours start doing the rounds from League people, trying to somehow claim a shallow victory, for them crossing codes when in fact it is not the case at all.

: Thu Feb 26, 2009 5:59 pm  

Ashton isn't getting picked regularly, is he?

: Thu Feb 26, 2009 6:03 pm  

On the coaches front, it's not an all things Australian is best attitude, in coaching that is a truism. British coaches are left behind in tactics, fitness, in pretty much every area of the game.

Why do we just accept that though? We play the same game, we're professional as well, there isn't any good reason for us to lag behind like this apart from the culture of accepting Aussie dominance of RL.

Clive Woodward took the England RU team from 6th and made them World Champions, one of his key beliefs was that England had to stop copying the Southern Hemisphere countries, and try to advance the game themselves, on their own terms. As long as we spend all our time trying to copy what the Aussies are doing, we'll never catch up

: Thu Feb 26, 2009 6:06 pm  

Cruncher wrote:

But League will always be outbid under the current circs. Surely only those who've failed in Union - Harris, Pryce, Walker - will come back. Or those like Henry Paul, who are veterans.

I think saying Harris failed in union is a bit strong - he didn't set the world alight, but he was a useful player even at test level (albeit in a fairly weak team). I agree with your point, though, I'm just being fussy!

: Thu Feb 26, 2009 6:38 pm  

Quacoe wrote:

Why do we just accept that though?

We don't, they either get sacked or don't get jobs.

We play the same game, we're professional as well, there isn't any good reason for us to lag behind like this apart from the culture of accepting Aussie dominance of RL.

Clive Woodward took the England RU team from 6th and made them World Champions, one of his key beliefs was that England had to stop copying the Southern Hemisphere countries, and try to advance the game themselves, on their own terms. As long as we spend all our time trying to copy what the Aussies are doing, we'll never catch up

I agree, others have said that we as a sport are too insular, and it's true in this respect as well. Why aren't our young coaches going into other sports looking at what they do and taking what's best and applying it to our game.

Maybe it's money? When you get to the pinnacle of professional sport, each small increase costs more money, and we aren't flush with cash, however there must be principles and ideas that can be adapted. As you say, taking the lead from the Aussies is never going to work, they'll always be a step ahead of us.

: Thu Feb 26, 2009 6:40 pm  

jonh wrote:

i may be wrong but it seems because SBW is unhappy in union people are assuming Gasnier and Ashton are without any basis for this. Not seen Gasnier play but from what i have seen of Ashton he looks to be enjoying his rugby at Northampton.

I think more often than not the unhappy in union rumours start doing the rounds from League people, trying to somehow claim a shallow victory, for them crossing codes when in fact it is not the case at all.

I know i've mentioned Gasnier a few times because he's not been playing very well in Union. I've seen him at least twice against Quins this season in the HC comp and he was woeful. They are playing him on the wing and his confidence looks shot. He was making basic mistakes like dropping routine balls and missing tackles.

It's not starting any rumours it's just what i've seen. I just know that he's failed to make the impact that a player who could be considered the best centre of his generation and one of the top Aussie centres of all time should have had.

I think the Ashton rumours have started due to his lack of games. He’s gone from being the darling fb to hardly playing. Some people have mentioned he maybe having attitude issues but I can’t comment on that as I don’t know

: Thu Feb 26, 2009 6:44 pm  

Quacoe wrote:

Why do we just accept that though? We play the same game, we're professional as well, there isn't any good reason for us to lag behind like this apart from the culture of accepting Aussie dominance of RL.

Clive Woodward took the England RU team from 6th and made them World Champions, one of his key beliefs was that England had to stop copying the Southern Hemisphere countries, and try to advance the game themselves, on their own terms. As long as we spend all our time trying to copy what the Aussies are doing, we'll never catch up

If i was a money man like IL and i truly wanted to bring Wigan back to the top then this is the man i'd bring in as a consultant. Someone who can objectively look at what's going on at the club and how we can become more professional. He’s got a key eye for detail and set ups and would be a massive coup for RL.

: Thu Feb 26, 2009 7:00 pm  

thepriestman85 wrote:

If i was a money man like IL and i truly wanted to bring Wigan back to the top then this is the man i'd bring in as a consultant. Someone who can objectively look at what's going on at the club and how we can become more professional. He’s got a key eye for detail and set ups and would be a massive coup for RL.

He didn't do much good at Southampton FC.

: Thu Feb 26, 2009 7:57 pm  

Billinge_Lump wrote:

He didn't do much good at Southampton FC.

True but there were all sorts of rumours of dressing room unrest and the players not respecting him due to be ignorant puffballers

I do think he'd be the right guy to bring in tho.

: Thu Feb 26, 2009 8:23 pm  

Cruncher wrote:

I hear these sorts of rumours about many who've gone to Union. It makes you wonder whether these guys really are unsettled or whether they're just angling for a new contract - in effect creating an auction for their services.

I don't suppose you can blame them. It's a short career. But League will always be outbid under the current circs. Surely only those who've failed in Union - Harris, Pryce, Walker - will come back. Or those like Henry Paul, who are veterans.

Who has Super League lost by being outbid to union? Ashton, but as already said, he was no sad loss. Myler? Is doing ok in RU, but wouldn't have set the RL world alight. Farrell went with his dad. As you say, Pryce and Walker failed, but they were not missed by their clubs. The big money is in French RU, Stade de France apparently has a £20m turnover. But French RU isn't targeting us. And the Aussie stars that they have signed have on the whole been dismal, expensive, failures.I think the fear of the RU poachers is greater than the reality.