Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 10:20 am  

I'll tell you one thing. There is no way in the world that Wigan nil Hudds going down to 12 men after 16 mins, 11 for the last 8 mins and losing a FB after 3 mins. Absolutely no chance. However because its us, its simply because "Huddersfield were toothless". No other team in SL could've done that, not a chance.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 10:30 am  

The Yellow Giraffe wrote:

No. You have had a better season so far. You haven't been the better team so far. There is a difference. But this is one of those that could drag on so we can agree to disagree on it.

We are having a better season so far but not the better team go figure,so yes we agree to disagree

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 10:32 am  

Stu M wrote:

I'll tell you one thing. There is no way in the world that Wigan nil Hudds going down to 12 men after 16 mins, 11 for the last 8 mins and losing a FB after 3 mins. Absolutely no chance. However because its us, its simply because "Huddersfield were toothless". No other team in SL could've done that, not a chance.

But that is your opinion saying Wigan have no chance of emulating Saints against Hudds but we will never know.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 10:33 am  

The Yellow Giraffe wrote:

I was directly answering someone who mentioned possession and territory and said they thought Wigan were on top. I didn't mention points, so your sarcastic question is a bit needless really mate. You talk about having grown up discussion so let's do that

It was a bit sarcastic mate but I grow tired of Saints fans pointing to territory or yardage and saying it makes you the better team. It doesn't. It's one in game metric (albeit an important one) of which there are many equally important ones. I would say, for a team such as ourselves who can score from anywhere on the field, that it's not even the most important. Set completion is far more important to a team like ours.

Its like saying a boxer dominated the centre of the ring so is the better fighter despite landing fewer punches or getting knocked out. I'm not saying I wouldn't like us to close the advantage you currently have in this department...of course I would...but I equally want to make less errors than you or have more possession etc. They're all equally important.

As I said elsewhere; we play our way and you play yours. I don't think pointing to one teams particular strength and claiming it is the single most important factor in determining who is best is valid. As for a grown up discussion; show me a single post where a Saints fan doesn't use yardage or territory as the incontrovertible reason Saints are the better side and I'll apologise for my sarcasm.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 10:34 am  

Stu M wrote:

I'll tell you one thing. There is no way in the world that Wigan nil Hudds going down to 12 men after 16 mins, 11 for the last 8 mins and losing a FB after 3 mins. Absolutely no chance. However because its us, its simply because "Huddersfield were toothless". No other team in SL could've done that, not a chance.

Do you not even see the irony in this post Stu?

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 10:44 am  

Phuzzy wrote:

It was a bit sarcastic mate but I grow tired of Saints fans pointing to territory or yardage and saying it makes you the better team.

I have never said, insinuated or implied that. I was pointing out Wigan hadn't got on top in those areas which is what another posted had said.

Phuzzy wrote:

As I said elsewhere; we play our way and you play yours.

I agree and have said the same myself in a complimentary fashion about Wigan.

Phuzzy wrote:

I don't think pointing to one teams particular strength and claiming it is the single most important factor in determining who is best is valid.

I agree, hence why I haven't done that.

Phuzzy wrote:

As for a grown up discussion; show me a single post where a Saints fan doesn't use yardage or territory as the incontrovertible reason Saints are the better side and I'll apologise for my sarcasm.

Literally me, all over this thread. I have said both teams have contrasting styles and when we meet again it could go either way.

I haven't said yardage and territory is the be all and end all, I haven't said it's the most important factor and I haven't said it makes us the better team. Literally read my posts this morning and after the Magic game and you will realise I have done none of the things you claim I have.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 10:49 am  

Phuzzy wrote:

Do you not even see the irony in this post Stu?

No not really. Go on educate me.

All I see is a complete and utter lack of respect for what we did last Friday. Even the neutral pundits were describing it as the performance of the season. French scores 7 and you beat Hull 60-0 and yet our performance is still being talked about more. Go figure.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 10:58 am  

The Yellow Giraffe wrote:

I have never said, insinuated or implied that. I was pointing out Wigan hadn't got on top in those areas which is what another posted had said.

I agree and have said the same myself in a complimentary fashion about Wigan.

I agree, hence why I haven't done that.

Literally me, all over this thread. I have said both teams have contrasting styles and when we meet again it could go either way.

I haven't said yardage and territory is the be all and end all, I haven't said it's the most important factor and I haven't said it makes us the better team. Literally read my posts this morning and after the Magic game and you will realise I have done none of the things you claim I have.

Mate, we must be living in some sort of alternate reality. You literally posted:

"Quite shocked at this. I thought territorially we battered you personally and said this on here after the game. In terms of metres made on the day we were over 400m more than you for example (despite you scoring from two long range breaks from Field and french too). We also made more carries and you made more tackles. So in terms of both possession and territory we were on top. You were forever finishing sets in your own half. We were camped in your half for the start of the game but I don't recall us being under the pump on our line for long spells."

If that is not focussing on how territory isn't the defining factor as to why you were the best, I don't know what is.

That said if you don't believe that to be the case despite posting it then fair enough.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 11:05 am  

Phuzzy wrote:

Mate, we must be living in some sort of alternate reality. You literally posted:

"Quite shocked at this. I thought territorially we battered you personally and said this on here after the game. In terms of metres made on the day we were over 400m more than you for example (despite you scoring from two long range breaks from Field and french too). We also made more carries and you made more tackles. So in terms of both possession and territory we were on top. You were forever finishing sets in your own half. We were camped in your half for the start of the game but I don't recall us being under the pump on our line for long spells."

If that is not focussing on how territory isn't the defining factor as to why you were the best, I don't know what is.

That said if you don't believe that to be the case despite posting it then fair enough.

I posted that in direct response to someone who brought possession and territory up!! I didn't bring it up.

Did I say that because of those things we are a better team than you or that they are the only factors that matter? No.

What I did go on to say, which you conveniently ignore, is that we have contrasting styles, Wigan are more ruthless, can hurt you from anywhere and games between us can go either way.

How on earth do you translate that to me saying only yardage and territory matters and Saints are the much better team? It makes no sense mate. Please judge me on what I have actually said in the full context they were said and not on made up arguments that make it easy for you to have a pop.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion : Thu Jul 21, 2022 11:08 am  

Stu M wrote:

No not really. Go on educate me.

All I see is a complete and utter lack of respect for what we did last Friday. Even the neutral pundits were describing it as the performance of the season. French scores 7 and you beat Hull 60-0 and yet our performance is still being talked about more. Go figure.

Ok I'll educate you

Firstly, wouldn't you say that the very definition of toothless (in rugby terms) is being unable to score points? Wouldn't you say that being unable to score points against 12 and then 11 men would further define it? If not, would you care to give me a better definition of toothless?

Secondly, you're asking for Wigan fans to give credit for your
Huddersfield performance whilst simultaneously belittling the semi final win (amongst others) and claiming 'unfair' when you don't get it.

I won't even comment on your assertion that "no other team could do it" (sic) as I shouldn't need to.

Seeing the irony yet?

For what it's worth, your performance against Huddersfield was outstanding.