Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Fri Jun 23, 2023 1:08 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

All that is gone with Saints is week to week intensity. That won’t come back because Woolf really drove that but they’re favourites for everything IMO. They’ve shown enough in the WCC, against Wire with a weakened side and against us two weeks back to show they’re still a fantastic side. There will be a natural break up of the side over the next few seasons but there’s big potential for more trophies yet (sadly). If we believe anything else, we’re setting ourselves up for a fall.

Isn't it that intensity that wins trophies though? I'm not saying Saints can't turn it on for a final, should they get there but, much like ourselves, they seem to need to flip a switch rather than it being ingrained. That's a risky strategy for any team and is little more than a 50/50 call on which team will turn up for any given match as they found out last night. The Leeds second half capitulation for ourselves is another great example.

Were it not for the brain fart and having Kendal in their back pocket, I'm of the opinion that they'd already be out of the cup.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Fri Jun 23, 2023 1:49 pm  

Very enjoyable game last night. Hull were great and were very unlucky to have that Litten try ruled out by the video ref especially as it had been sent up as a try. Tony Smith has really turned them round.

Very amusing to see Saints fans complaining about opposition players "rubbing opponent's hair" after a mistake! I think my hypocrisy meter just exploded

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Fri Jun 23, 2023 2:07 pm  

Phuzzy wrote:

Isn't it that intensity that wins trophies though? I'm not saying Saints can't turn it on for a final, should they get there but, much like ourselves, they seem to need to flip a switch rather than it being ingrained. That's a risky strategy for any team and is little more than a 50/50 call on which team will turn up for any given match as they found out last night. The Leeds second half capitulation for ourselves is another great example.

Were it not for the brain fart and having Kendal in their back pocket, I'm of the opinion that they'd already be out of the cup.

I just think they’ve come back to the pack in terms of not being able to play at their cup final intensity week to week anymore. They spent a few seasons playing 90% of games at an intensity most teams could only get close to in the play offs, semi finals, finals etc and I don’t think that is there for them anymore. They are now doing what we’ve done for years (and we’ve shown it this past few weeks) and what other sides have done and are flicking a switch when the biggest games come around, as you say. I agree it’s risky in a way but it also doesn’t make them any less dangerous in the biggest games ‘if’ they can get to their best levels. I think they’ve shown already on a few occasions this season that they can get to extremely high levels, so they’ll still take some beating.

I hope they crash and burn like and I do see a real drop off coming in the next few years but it’s not there yet.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Fri Jun 23, 2023 4:39 pm  

Roby leaving will be a big shock. He seems able to get on the field and grab a game by the scruff of the neck. I don’t see that in their other players

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Fri Jun 23, 2023 5:08 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

All that is gone with Saints is week to week intensity. That won’t come back because Woolf really drove that but they’re favourites for everything IMO. They’ve shown enough in the WCC, against Wire with a weakened side and against us two weeks back to show they’re still a fantastic side. There will be a natural break up of the side over the next few seasons but there’s big potential for more trophies yet (sadly). If we believe anything else, we’re setting ourselves up for a fall.

Absolutely

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Fri Jun 23, 2023 9:13 pm  

NickyKiss wrote:

I just think they’ve come back to the pack in terms of not being able to play at their cup final intensity week to week anymore. They spent a few seasons playing 90% of games at an intensity most teams could only get close to in the play offs, semi finals, finals etc and I don’t think that is there for them anymore. They are now doing what we’ve done for years (and we’ve shown it this past few weeks) and what other sides have done and are flicking a switch when the biggest games come around, as you say. I agree it’s risky in a way but it also doesn’t make them any less dangerous in the biggest games ‘if’ they can get to their best levels. I think they’ve shown already on a few occasions this season that they can get to extremely high levels, so they’ll still take some beating.

I hope they crash and burn like and I do see a real drop off coming in the next few years but it’s not there yet.

I think this is spot on.

I don’t want this comment to come across arrogant but I do believe if every team played to their maximum potential we are still the best side and I genuinely don’t think there’s many honest people who will disagree. However we are hitting that level far less frequently this year than in previous years and I also think they gap between our best and yours for example is closer this year than previously. So all it takes is us being slightly off it and there’s 7 or 8 teams who could beat us.

The fact we are where we are in the table and yet still clear favourites to win the GF tells you that we are still “the team to beat” and the most likely to turn it on when it matters, but this is the least confident I’ve been of winning it at this stage then in any of the previous years.

If someone offered me the Challenge Cup now (to go with the WCC) and that’s the lot for the season then I’d happily take it. The season has a feeling that it could be one step too far for us in terms of this run we’ve had, but I won’t be writing us off yet.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Fri Jun 23, 2023 10:43 pm  

The Yellow Giraffe wrote:

I think this is spot on.

I don’t want this comment to come across arrogant but I do believe if every team played to their maximum potential we are still the best side and I genuinely don’t think there’s many honest people who will disagree. However we are hitting that level far less frequently this year than in previous years and I also think they gap between our best and yours for example is closer this year than previously. So all it takes is us being slightly off it and there’s 7 or 8 teams who could beat us.

The fact we are where we are in the table and yet still clear favourites to win the GF tells you that we are still “the team to beat” and the most likely to turn it on when it matters, but this is the least confident I’ve been of winning it at this stage then in any of the previous years.

If someone offered me the Challenge Cup now (to go with the WCC) and that’s the lot for the season then I’d happily take it. The season has a feeling that it could be one step too far for us in terms of this run we’ve had, but I won’t be writing us off yet.

I wouldn’t. You say we are the best team on paper but you would accept winning a trophy that no one cares about, save for small clubs over winning the only trophy that matters? That’s embarassing and Wigan level mentality

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Jun 24, 2023 6:35 am  

TheWarringtonWolve69 wrote:

I wouldn’t. You say we are the best team on paper but you would accept winning a trophy that no one cares about, save for small clubs over winning the only trophy that matters? That’s embarassing and Wigan level mentality

Shut up you clown.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Jun 24, 2023 8:16 am  

Quality YG, you've just gone up in my estimation.

I know unrelated to this particular thread but watching that dire performance from Huddersfield last night, they have the same issues as Saints but on a much higher level. Saints clearly have a much higher calibre of player but they both have ageing sides. They both have major rebuilds on but Huddersfield's side needs completely gutting. Saints at least have something to build on, Welsby (potentially) Batchelor, Lees, Sironen, Dodd (potentially), and the young prop who played a few weeks ago, can't remember his name but he looked a good prospect.

Re: Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE : Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:29 am  

To be honest I have a sneaky feeling we may see a new name on the SL trophy this year (and it's not Wire).

Catalans are quietly going under the radar, done us twice so far. Look very strong at home*. They look a very organised side that will beat anyone on their day.


*Watch them get pumped by Leigh now.