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Re: Announced crowds!

Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:18 pm

MattyB wrote:But other clubs have the same issue and their crowds are increasing?


Will be interesting to see if Saints improve their attendances this season aside of the WCC.

Matty where can I access year on year attendances for all SL clubs? If you could advise a link it would be appreciated.

Re: Announced crowds!

Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:21 pm

Every home game I went to last season in the South Stand I entered via a cash turnstile so I don't think that's really an issue anymore (not like the old days of having to get a ticket first).

Re: Announced crowds!

Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:24 pm

Itchy Arsenal wrote:https://www.rlfans.com/

Very difficult to argue with any of that.
If I'm honest I will be surprised if we have maintained ST levels per 2019 as although we finished quite strongly the early part of the year was pretty disastrous even allowing for the level of injuries and more people are dissatisfied with the quality of the game and the lack of atmosphere at any game at the DW.
Ive been a ST for years but even I have thought about "not bothering" and in 2016 & 2017 I actually gave my ST away part way through both seasons as the quality of the game week in week out was in my view downright abysmal.

The club and the game have got to come up with some new initiatives and maybe resurrect some old ones otherwise as you suggest the game will not survive in its present state.

For me we have to concentrate on new younger fans and making it easier for "roll up fans" to pay on the night.
The free ST for kids under 8 is a great start but we need other sustained targeted marketing on U18 fans e.g. SBW and the Toronto game. For me there should major marketing of this game with incentives for kids/families. We should have been saturating local schools on this forthcoming match to encourage kids to come and see SBW as soon as we knew he had signed for Toronto. The club's & the games lack of marketing is palpable at all times.

I'm obviously not a marketing guy but I'm a guy who knows that the club and the game in general is in severe need of re-branding. Personally I hate the "Warriors" and would abandon it however, if that is the way forward let's do properly or not at all. Very left field should we become Warriors and drop Wigan??

I buy a season ticket partly out of habit, partly because I can afford it and if I'm honest if I had pay on the night or buy a ticket in advance I know that I just wouldn't do it. To go to the North Stand queue up for ages to then walk back to the South stand just doesnt work for me. We need more pay by cash turnstiles and contactless payment turnstiles. We have got to make it easier for fans to have quick and easy access to the stadium.

The game has become too slow and too predictable. Time wasting still continues and I could scream at the number of interchanges that just breeds not very athletic athletes and lazy coaching. The lack of intensity for me is palpable in every game including games against Saints.
The 7th tackle against the attacking team when kicking into dead is a start to reducing the number of lazy, robotic last tackle options however, why don't we give the defending side unlimited tackles after such kicks which I'm sure would reduce such last tackle options. As a sport historically we have been brave with new rules/changes and we need more if we are to re-invigorate the game in becoming more of a spectacle.

Better people than me will have better ideas however, we seem to be sleep walking into oblivion and unless the current malaise is addressed then like you I don't really see much of a future other than a slow painful death.


I definitely think the last two games of last year had a huge negative impact on season ticket sales. A tonking from Saints and a miserable performance against Salford in front of next to no home spectators.

Re: Announced crowds!

Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:31 pm

Itchy Arsenal wrote:Will be interesting to see if Saints improve their attendances this season aside of the WCC.

Matty where can I access year on year attendances for all SL clubs? If you could advise a link it would be appreciated.


I'm gonna have to eat my own words as I've just done some digging on 2018 attendances (compared to the year before) and found that only two clubs increased during this time: Saints & Hull.

I must admit I thought Wire & Cas had also shown increases but obviously not! :roll:

https://www.cheshire-live.co.uk/sport/a ... n-15657897

2018 average attendances for this year's Super League teams (2017 figure in brackets)

Leeds Rhinos 12,807 (14,950)

Hull FC 12,174 (11,718)

Wigan Warriors 11,708 (13,983)

St Helens 11,478 (10,749)

Warrington Wolves 10,088 (10,478)

Catalans Dragons 8,353 (8,777)

Hull KR 7,964 (NA)

Castleford Tigers 7,898 (9,525)

Huddersfield Giants 5,745 (5,826)

Wakefield Trinity 5,244 (5,289)

Salford Red Devils 2,748 (4,703)


Will try find 2019 attendances.

Re: Announced crowds!

Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:41 pm

MattyB wrote:I'm gonna have to eat my own words as I've just done some digging on 2018 attendances (compared to the year before) and found that only two clubs increased during this time: Saints & Hull.

I must admit I thought Wire & Cas had also shown increases but obviously not! :roll:

https://www.cheshire-live.co.uk/sport/a ... n-15657897

2018 average attendances for this year's Super League teams (2017 figure in brackets)

Leeds Rhinos 12,807 (14,950)

Hull FC 12,174 (11,718)

Wigan Warriors 11,708 (13,983)

St Helens 11,478 (10,749)

Warrington Wolves 10,088 (10,478)

Catalans Dragons 8,353 (8,777)

Hull KR 7,964 (NA)

Castleford Tigers 7,898 (9,525)

Huddersfield Giants 5,745 (5,826)

Wakefield Trinity 5,244 (5,289)

Salford Red Devils 2,748 (4,703)


Will try find 2019 attendances.


Cheers Matty

Re: Announced crowds!

Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:52 pm

Itchy Arsenal wrote:Cheers Matty


Found them!


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_League_XXIV

2019 average attendances

Cas 7253 (7898) down
Catalans 10560 (8353) up
Hudds 5222 (5745) down
Hull FC 11478 (12174) down
Hull KR 8185 (7964) up
Leeds 11838 (12807) down
London 2021 NA
Salford 3676 (2748) up
Saints 11910 (11478) up
Wakefield 5468 (5244) up
Wire 10970 (10088) up
Wigan 11432 (11708) down

We have slipped to fourth with Leeds, Saints and Hull ahead.

Six teams show attendance increases - Catalans, Hull KR, Salford, Saints, Wakefield and Wire.

Re: Announced crowds!

Tue Jan 21, 2020 11:02 pm

MattyB wrote:Found them!


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_League_XXIV

2019 average attendances

Cas 7253 (7898) down
Catalans 10560 (8353) up
Hudds 5222 (5745) down
Hull FC 11478 (12174) down
Hull KR 8185 (7964) up
Leeds 11838 (12807) down
London 2021 NA
Salford 3676 (2748) up
Saints 11910 (11478) up
Wakefield 5468 (5244) up
Wire 10970 (10088) up
Wigan 11432 (11708) down

We have slipped to fourth with Leeds, Saints and Hull ahead.

Six teams show attendance increases - Catalans, Hull KR, Salford, Saints, Wakefield and Wire.


Weirdly despite all the doom and gloom, had we increased our attendances by a mere 500 spectators last year we would have topped the group (including the all conquering, all entertaining, it's gone wide to West, never write off St Helens).

Re: Announced crowds!

Wed Jan 22, 2020 12:09 am

MattyB wrote:Weirdly despite all the doom and gloom, had we increased our attendances by a mere 500 spectators last year we would have topped the group (including the all conquering, all entertaining, it's gone wide to West, never write off St Helens).


And they had 2 home derbies to our 1
Switch that about and there would be nothing in it

It's still not good though, we should, after 10 years of Very Good success (and I appreciate people will view it in different ways) be looking IMO to be around 13k plus as a year in year out average.
Remember at the start of last year there were lots of people all over sites telling us that the rugby was boring, Wane had to go, as if that was the answer to the gates issue.
They set up the deal with Lam and Edward's and there was this positivity around the place (not by everyone but a large percantage) and guess what, crowds went down.

Potentially this year, investing in 2/3 top names to add to the late addition of French last year, and what do we think will happen? All those that wanted star names and leneghan to take his hands out of his pockets etc as that will be the answer, do you think it will suddenly increase by 2k a game average?
Me personally, No.

Re: Announced crowds!

Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:36 am

Jukesays wrote:And they had 2 home derbies to our 1
Switch that about and there would be nothing in it

It's still not good though, we should, after 10 years of Very Good success (and I appreciate people will view it in different ways) be looking IMO to be around 13k plus as a year in year out average.
Remember at the start of last year there were lots of people all over sites telling us that the rugby was boring, Wane had to go, as if that was the answer to the gates issue.
They set up the deal with Lam and Edward's and there was this positivity around the place (not by everyone but a large percantage) and guess what, crowds went down.

Potentially this year, investing in 2/3 top names to add to the late addition of French last year, and what do we think will happen? All those that wanted star names and leneghan to take his hands out of his pockets etc as that will be the answer, do you think it will suddenly increase by 2k a game average?
Me personally, No.


And they get the luxury of two home games again this season too.

Recovering 2k lost supporters is going to be a hard slog. To be honest chances are the same 2k will probably never return and it's for the club to attract 2k new supporters (young fans coming of age).

I remember when my two lads played at Judes, when they start off young all the parents are there at training sessions and matches. New friendships through coaches and parents are formed (some of my best friends that I still see today we met this way).

The kids socialise and get season tickets together and so do the parents. At one point (around 2012) there was over thirty parents and kids all sat together in the South Stand. It was a great weekly social occasion.

Guess what happened, the kids got older. Some dropped away from playing, the parents started to fall away from watching the kids at training and games, would pick and choose the big Wigan games, then it became just the finals, then finally stopped all together. Last season the count went from thirty of us in 2012 to five.

But its cyclical, at all amateur clubs today new kids are playing, parents show up in droves and socialise. This social group is one where Wigan should be targeting.

Re: Announced crowds!

Wed Jan 22, 2020 8:05 am

MR FRISK wrote:A few times last season and in the past the "official attendance" given during games has sometimes looked a lot different from the number of people attending. I have a question does anyone on this forum work for the club and knows how the figures are accurate e.g. lets say there are about 9,000 season ticket holders but about 7,500 turn up sometimes does that missing 1,500 get included in the official attendance? In the friendly game last Sunday it was 3,700 but some people think the crowd was about 4,500! I was there in 1987 crushed tight like a sardine for the World club challenge game when there was a capacity of 36,895 but looked :READING: from looking at the highlights on youtube of the game and there could have been well over 44,000 that night!


According to a police officer who I knew and on duty that night, it was estimated by the police that there were 43,000 inside the ground, as a result of the Police Inspector in charge deciding, when the official figure of 36,895 was reached with hundreds still outside, he made a decision to allow everyone in, rather than have any trouble and a possible storming of the ground, as many had come from around the North of England and beyond, which included many who been drinking well before the game. As the club did not expect the crowd to be so high, it was not made a all ticket game except for seating.

It must be remembered that at the time, there were not the same level of thinking by the police about control of mass crowds at sporting venues as there has been since Hillsborough.

I hate to think what it was like when the ground held a record attendance of 47,747 for a game with St Helens in 1959.
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