Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:25 pm  

I think it's a perfectly fair argument from the English sides. People will think it's a cop out from a terrible year for English Rugby but it all makes sense.

The Celtic League is shocking. Watch any televised game and the grounds are 1/2 full at best most of the time. Go over to the Munster or Leinster forums and they only care about The Heineken Cup. Watch any Pro 12 game with a top Irish side and no matter how clued up on Rugby you are you'd struggle to recognise most of the squad some weeks. Must be bad supporting a team that only cares for 6 games a year, plus your big derby games. All you have to do is finish above Connacht if you're Irish, Dragons if you're Welsh and you're in The Heineken Cup. Simple. The Scottish and Italians don't even need to worry about where they finish.

You look at the Premiership and week in week out squads are tested to the max. There's 3 games to go and the top 4 and relegation still aren't decided. Teams can't afford to rest key players and so risk injuries every week. Whilst I love that England and France are the only 2 Countries with a competitive league system, it's no coincidence that Ulster and Edinburgh who are very hit and miss in the league have made it there. Leinster - fair enough, they're a different class. Clermont too, but then having a 16 million pound salary cap does help.

Watching the matches this weekend was sad from an English point of view. Especially being a Sale fan. Toulon ripping our top team to shreds, whilst having Dean Schofield, Eifion Lewis Roberts and Sebastian Bruno all playing outstandingly. Paul Williams who we had last year got the winning try for Stade Francais. Saracens never looked like winning form the first minute against Clermont.

I hope Edinburgh win it but can't see past Clermont or Leinster.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:09 pm  

I'm not a fan of the Heineken cup for a few reasons. Two of them being the format and the fact that it feels like going through the motions till it gets to the quarters or sometimes semis.
In an ideal world I'd have the top two teams from England, France, Wales, Ireland with the champions of Scotland and Italy going into two groups of five. First in group A plays second in group B and vice versa. I don't see the point of including clubs from other nations because they are miles away from the level of the better European leagues. This is obviously impossible because we have the Celtic League, but I like the idea of having to actually finish in the top two to go into what should be the top club competition in European union.

You're right about the crowds, Shark J. They don't often get mentioned in the press but they are truly woeful and it makes you wonder how the clubs would manage without their respective unions. The whole idea of the regions and Celtic league was to stop the rot with regard to falling crowds and lack of interest in the less glamorous games. If crowds continue to fall and we see more problems like those in Italy and Wales, what next?

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:15 pm  

I think the English whingeing would have a bit more strength if their teams were doing better. Let's face it, the poor results of the English teams are not because the poor dears are tired, but because of the garbage rugby they have been serving up. Apart from Quins none of the English representatives this year appeared to me capable of moving away from forward dominated 9 or 10 man rugby. Saracens yesterday clearly had one gameplan: score more penalties than Clermont. The game was up for them after the first ten minutes, but they had no alternative and stuck rigidly to their anti-rugby until the end of the match. Perhaps instead of seeing exactly how long the scrum half can keep the ball at the back of a ruck before passing it, they played a bit of rugby they might win a few more games.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:00 am  

Moan, moan, moan. Haven't the English noticed there is only one French team left in the Cup?

Come on the mighty Ulster Rugby.

Ulster, Munster and Leinster have great crowds, (Ulster over 10,000 vs Arioni) it's the rest dragging the Irish down, espeically the Scottish crowds, absolutely shocking. As for the quality of the Celtic league I agree with others above, it is absolutely dreadful and to be honest I can only bare to watch it if Ulster are playing and even then...

The biggest problem for union is the opposite problem for league. Intenrationals dominate everything, which tends to lead to clubs having to field weaking sides, which is annoying as your weekly club fixture is you bread and butter. You should be turning out for them regardless of whether you are in an international squad or not. Sinfield played 40 odd games last year. So Ferris, Trimble and Best playnig a few more for Ulster shouldn't really be a problem.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:15 pm  

http://www.sportinglife.com/rugbyunion/ ... um=twitter Interesting, no?

http://www.sportinglife.com/rugbyunion/ ... um=twitter Interesting, no?

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:08 pm  

Ande wrote:

http://www.sportinglife.com/rugbyunion/news/story_get.cgi?STORY_NAME=rugby/12/04/10/RUGBYU_Wasps.html&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

Interesting, no?

beg to differ mate but...

as a Wasps fan it IS interesting - fingers crossed some 'money bags' or consortium will step in and save the famous old club....

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:56 pm  

sanjunien wrote:

beg to differ mate but...

as a Wasps fan it IS interesting - fingers crossed some 'money bags' or consortium will step in and save the famous old club....

I hope they go bust, would p*ss myself laughing.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Tue Apr 10, 2012 4:03 pm  

Tre Cool wrote:

I hope they go bust, would p*ss myself laughing.

I think they are bust - that's why they need bailing out !

I don't like seeing any business go under - why is it the british hate seeing success stories and thrive on seeing people or businesses in trouble ?

totally amazing attitude...

you build them up and then knock them down......

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Tue Apr 10, 2012 4:22 pm  

sanjunien wrote:

I think they are bust - that's why they need bailing out !

I don't like seeing any business go under - why is it the british hate seeing success stories and thrive on seeing people or businesses in trouble ?

totally amazing attitude...

you build them up and then knock them down......

No no. I don't like seeing businesses in trouble. I like seeing 'rugby' union clubs going under.

Re: If you must discuss Union, do it here II : Tue Apr 10, 2012 4:31 pm  

Tre Cool wrote:

No no. I don't like seeing businesses in trouble. I like seeing 'rugby' union clubs going under.

that's all right then...

weird thing is that I like both codes equally - but I don't really know why cos' RU is crap most of the time....

must be my age or something ?