Re: New Signing.... : Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:56 pm  

kinleycat wrote:

Well said sir.

Believe me it is as I see it. Pity the BBC etc couldn't make a little mention of the result - they did manage to mention our defeats at Loiners and Catalans!

Re: New Signing.... : Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:17 pm  

vastman wrote:

Well you wouldn't be you if you didn't find something to worry about, glass half full and all that.

We have 7 props in the squad, Amor, Wilkes, Johnson, Raleigh (and yes he see's himself as a prop), James and Trout and Spiers for emergency. How many do you need!

Come on fella, worry about it when or even if it happens.

I know where you're coming from Vasty, kinda agree to a point. Not knocking Agar as I do think he's recruited quite well thus far but here is my opinion for what it's worth;

1 - Surely we should be looking at QUALITY over QUANTITY. Is Spiers really a prop? Is Trout for that matter? Could these lads really come into a big SL game and lead the team forward? Sorry to say it, I don't think they could. Don't get me wrong I think Trout is much improved but a prop, now..... not yet IMHO.

2 - Amor: I really like this guy, huge potential, best prop at the club IMHO but the way I understand it he's not officially ours yet so we could lose him. This is a worry.

3 - Wilkes: I like Wilkes, you know what you'll get with him. Works his socks off, a real grafter and goes forward. No issues at all. Glad to have him back. But a line breaker he is not.

4 - Johnson/Raleigh: Very similar mould to Wilkes. Both players by their own admission prefer to play 2nd Row. I don't doubt they'll work hard but will they make the yards? Are they line breakers?

5 - James: Unknown quality. Fingers crossed he goes well and gives us something extra. But the jury is out and he is somewhat of a gamble at the moment.

I think generally the fans I know/have spoken to tend to agree we have some grafters and are in a far better place this season than last but the worry/concern (whatever you want to call it) is that we're lacking a bit of real size and presence up top, some real grunt and for want of a better term a line breaker.

IMHO I think we're just lacking that little bit of something extra that could be the difference between us finishing inside or outside the Top 8.

Baring in mind where we were this time last year yes I admit I'm been very picky/demanding but I really do feel that we're probably 2/3 players away from having a really good squad that *could* challenge for the Top 8.

Re: New Signing.... : Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:26 pm  

Come On The Trin wrote:

I know where you're coming from Vasty, kinda agree to a point. Not knocking Agar as I do think he's recruited quite well thus far but here is my opinion for what it's worth;

1 - Surely we should be looking at QUALITY over QUANTITY. Is Spiers really a prop? Is Trout for that matter? Could these lads really come into a big SL game and lead the team forward? Sorry to say it, I don't think they could. Don't get me wrong I think Trout is much improved but a prop, now..... not yet IMHO.

2 - Amor: I really like this guy, huge potential, best prop at the club IMHO but the way I understand it he's not officially ours yet so we could lose him. This is a worry.

3 - Wilkes: I like Wilkes, you know what you'll get with him. Works his socks off, a real grafter and goes forward. No issues at all. Glad to have him back. But a line breaker he is not.

4 - Johnson/Raleigh: Very similar mould to Wilkes. Both players by their own admission prefer to play 2nd Row. I don't doubt they'll work hard but will they make the yards? Are they line breakers?

5 - James: Unknown quality. Fingers crossed he goes well and gives us something extra. But the jury is out and he is somewhat of a gamble at the moment.

I think generally the fans I know/have spoken to tend to agree we have some grafters and are in a far better place this season than last but the worry/concern (whatever you want to call it) is that we're lacking a bit of real size and presence up top, some real grunt and for want of a better term a line breaker.

IMHO I think we're just lacking that little bit of something extra that could be the difference between us finishing inside or outside the Top 8.

Baring in mind where we were this time last year yes I admit I'm been very picky/demanding but I really do feel that we're probably 2/3 players away from having a really good squad that *could* challenge for the Top 8.

Pretty much spot on for me. We have a good set of forwards who will work their nuts off but they are much of a muchness. I don't buy into the theory that the rule changes negates the need for big props. Sorry but that is IMHO a load of rubbish. Take a look at the NRL, the best club competition in the world, where they have had 10 interchanges for a few years now. Has it result in a new breed of smaller more moblie props? Not at all, all teams packs a just as big, if not bigger than before. All it has done has caused the big blokes to push their fitness on further without lessening their impact. Prime example is Manly Sea Eagles. They have a guy who comes off the bench for them every week called George Rose who makes Solomona look like a fitness freak. Where he used to play in 10-12 minute spells these are now 15-18 minutes but the impact he provides remains the same. He may play less minutes than his fellow props but the extra work that the opposition has to do to contain him, attracting more men into the tackle, dragging men out of position and getting through the line more than make up for it. And how did it work for Manly? They are the NRL champions.

For me we could do with a big raw boned prop to get us going forward from our line and hurt the oppostion near theres. This would complete the squad perfectly. Whether there is one available within our price range is another matter.

Re: New Signing.... : Mon Jan 23, 2012 10:38 pm  

Come On The Trin wrote:

I know where you're coming from Vasty, kinda agree to a point. Not knocking Agar as I do think he's recruited quite well thus far but here is my opinion for what it's worth;

1 - Surely we should be looking at QUALITY over QUANTITY. Is Spiers really a prop? Is Trout for that matter? Could these lads really come into a big SL game and lead the team forward? Sorry to say it, I don't think they could. Don't get me wrong I think Trout is much improved but a prop, now..... not yet IMHO.

2 - Amor: I really like this guy, huge potential, best prop at the club IMHO but the way I understand it he's not officially ours yet so we could lose him. This is a worry.

3 - Wilkes: I like Wilkes, you know what you'll get with him. Works his socks off, a real grafter and goes forward. No issues at all. Glad to have him back. But a line breaker he is not.

4 - Johnson/Raleigh: Very similar mould to Wilkes. Both players by their own admission prefer to play 2nd Row. I don't doubt they'll work hard but will they make the yards? Are they line breakers?

5 - James: Unknown quality. Fingers crossed he goes well and gives us something extra. But the jury is out and he is somewhat of a gamble at the moment.

I think generally the fans I know/have spoken to tend to agree we have some grafters and are in a far better place this season than last but the worry/concern (whatever you want to call it) is that we're lacking a bit of real size and presence up top, some real grunt and for want of a better term a line breaker.

IMHO I think we're just lacking that little bit of something extra that could be the difference between us finishing inside or outside the Top 8.

Baring in mind where we were this time last year yes I admit I'm been very picky/demanding but I really do feel that we're probably 2/3 players away from having a really good squad that *could* challenge for the Top 8.

We've got Amor for the full year with no chance Leeds can call him back, only next season have they got a option on him, it's been gone over a fair few times the Amor deal on here.

Re: New Signing.... : Tue Jan 24, 2012 8:52 am  

Theboyem wrote:

Pretty much spot on for me. We have a good set of forwards who will work their nuts off but they are much of a muchness. I don't buy into the theory that the rule changes negates the need for big props. Sorry but that is IMHO a load of rubbish. Take a look at the NRL, the best club competition in the world, where they have had 10 interchanges for a few years now. Has it result in a new breed of smaller more moblie props? Not at all, all teams packs a just as big, if not bigger than before. All it has done has caused the big blokes to push their fitness on further without lessening their impact. Prime example is Manly Sea Eagles. They have a guy who comes off the bench for them every week called George Rose who makes Solomona look like a fitness freak. Where he used to play in 10-12 minute spells these are now 15-18 minutes but the impact he provides remains the same. He may play less minutes than his fellow props but the extra work that the opposition has to do to contain him, attracting more men into the tackle, dragging men out of position and getting through the line more than make up for it. And how did it work for Manly? They are the NRL champions.

For me we could do with a big raw boned prop to get us going forward from our line and hurt the oppostion near theres. This would complete the squad perfectly. Whether there is one available within our price range is another matter.

See I don't go for that, I think that era has gone, it's just my opinion though.

I think people may be confused about what they want, pin pointing size which I don't think is the issue.

What people are really wanting IMHO is that rarest of breeds these days. It's the older prop, who's big enough but knows all the tricks and will take the game to the opposition by leading the charge. Paul King offered a bit of that a few seasons ago, he came on and the tide would start to turn (a bit). If I had one fear with this pack it's that it may lack the guile these old pro's offer. Of the two who may offer it I don't see it being Wilkes, he's hard as nails and a fantastic player but he's no leader unless his stint at London has changed him. Raleigh looks more likely, he looks like a bit of a thinker who could possibly do it but maybe Hudds fans (normal ones) can tell us. The others are all far to young to take on the roll for me.

Problem is I can't see one of these available anywhere because we simply don't build them that way anymore, there are few Bill Ashursts out there these days.

However I think that's why Southern and Ali where signed. Ali has the spark and Southern the graft and guts so there is a plan B.

Re: New Signing.... : Tue Jan 24, 2012 8:56 am  

The general consensus is that we could do with a prop (or two). Is there anyone out there though who would add quality to the squad. I think we've recruited well in a short space of time. Things look quite promising. I don't think we should sign a player(s) for the sake of it.

Re: New Signing.... : Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:15 am  

vastman wrote:

See I don't go for that, I think that era has gone, it's just my opinion though.

I think people may be confused about what they want, pin pointing size which I don't think is the issue.

What people are really wanting IMHO is that rarest of breeds these days. It's the older prop, who's big enough but knows all the tricks and will take the game to the opposition by leading the charge. Paul King offered a bit of that a few seasons ago, he came on and the tide would start to turn (a bit). If I had one fear with this pack it's that it may lack the guile these old pro's offer. Of the two who may offer it I don't see it being Wilkes, he's hard as nails and a fantastic player but he's no leader unless his stint at London has changed him. Raleigh looks more likely, he looks like a bit of a thinker who could possibly do it but maybe Hudds fans (normal ones) can tell us. The others are all far to young to take on the roll for me.

Problem is I can't see one of these available anywhere because we simply don't build them that way anymore, there are few Bill Ashursts out there these days.

However I think that's why Southern and Ali where signed. Ali has the spark and Southern the graft and guts so there is a plan B.

I think there are enough leaders in the pack, to warrant just good hard running from the front rowers.
Southern and Aiton barking and guiding!!!
I aren't suggesting some know how and guille aren't needed, just not so much.
What we know about the likes of Amor, Wilkes, Johnson and Raleigh is, they aren't shirkers, if you ask them they'll run all day, and i'm sure that will be the RA's plan going ino the season.

Re: New Signing.... : Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:32 am  

NEwildcat wrote:

The general consensus is that we could do with a prop (or two). Is there anyone out there though who would add quality to the squad. I think we've recruited well in a short space of time. Things look quite promising. I don't think we should sign a player(s) for the sake of it.

No I'd say it's that most of us are happy with what we have, but if the right player came along - but then that applies to most clubs.

Re: New Signing.... : Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:33 am  

kinleycat wrote:

I think there are enough leaders in the pack, to warrant just good hard running from the front rowers.
Southern and Aiton barking and guiding!!!
I aren't suggesting some know how and guille aren't needed, just not so much.
What we know about the likes of Amor, Wilkes, Johnson and Raleigh is, they aren't shirkers, if you ask them they'll run all day, and i'm sure that will be the RA's plan going ino the season.

I wouldn't disagree.With most teams the problem is in the head not in the BMI.

Re: New Signing.... : Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:13 pm  

It's Agar saying we need a good old fashioned BIG number 8.. ........not just me