Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:32 am  

wrencat1873 wrote:

It's difficult for people who are partisan (in any direction) not to slant their posts from their own viewpoint.
However, there is little doubt that the "signposting" of easing restrictions, together with the actions of the infamous Tory advisor, has left people thinking "sod it" and off they go to please themselves.
At the risk of sounding like a miserable so and so, I can see any fun in sharing a beach with several hundred thousand strangers - not even in the "good times" and to do so when there is still a huge risk to peoples health ??
I've far more sympathy with the Liverpool fans.
Just imagine if Trinity won the cup or the League, you wouldn't want to mark the occasion with a can of Fosters in your front room.

Agree with most of the last paragraph WC, it reminds me of a scene from a Benidorm holiday hence why I don’t go there, the only point I slightly differ is that Liverpool have had plenty of huge success over recent years unlike us but then again they are scouses

Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Fri Jul 03, 2020 2:27 pm  

Dunkirk Spirit wrote:

Not many people, including myself are denouncing the Black lives Matter section. What most people including myself object to is the Black Lives Movement. This is a dangerous far left movement, with disturbing ambitions. Don’t just take my word for it, vist the Black Lives Movement’s web site.

It’s a bit quiet on our forum just lately, let’s try and get some debate going again. I posted the above a couple of weeks ago, when many were bending the knee, politicians, sports celebrities, etc denouncing those who, criticised the BLM. Well, thankfully, theses people decided to look into what the BLMovement, real intentions are. Egg on face, for some.

Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Fri Jul 03, 2020 2:35 pm  

Dunkirk Spirit wrote:

It’s a bit quiet on our forum just lately, let’s try and get some debate going again. I posted the above a couple of weeks ago, when many were bending the knee, politicians, sports celebrities, etc denouncing those who, criticised the BLM. Well, thankfully, theses people decided to look into what the BLMovement, real intentions are. Egg on face, for some.

Have I heard correctly that they support some overseas terrorist group, I’ve tried to follow up my info on various sites but struggling to find any thing.

[Pumpetypump]

Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Fri Jul 03, 2020 2:45 pm  

Dunkirk Spirit wrote:

It’s a bit quiet on our forum just lately, let’s try and get some debate going again. I posted the above a couple of weeks ago, when many were bending the knee, politicians, sports celebrities, etc denouncing those who, criticised the BLM. Well, thankfully, theses people decided to look into what the BLMovement, real intentions are. Egg on face, for some.

I think you have to draw the clear distinction between the Black Lives matter organisation, and the Black Lives Matter movement. The movement is the aim that most right-minded people feel of ensuring BAME communities have the same advantages as white people. The organisation however, have specific policy objectives that you don't necessarily have to support (some of their objectives I strongly support, others I strongly disagree with). Crystal Palace for example have publicly distanced themselves from the organisation today, whilst assuring everyone that they support the movement / ethos.

Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Fri Jul 03, 2020 2:56 pm  

Big lads mate wrote:

Have I heard correctly that they support some overseas terrorist group, I’ve tried to follow up my info on various sites but struggling to find any thing.

They, the BLMovement/organisation have spoken out in support of the Palestinians in their struggle over Israeli occupation of some Palestinian land. Right or Wrong, many people think this is Antisemitism.

[Pumpetypump]

Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Fri Jul 03, 2020 3:15 pm  

Dunkirk Spirit wrote: They, the BLMovement have spoken out in support of the Palestinians in their struggle over Israeli occupation of some Palestinian land. Right or Wrong, many people think this is Antisemitism. The occupation of Palestinian land is illegal under international law, so it's legitimate to criticise that Israeli policy. Antisemitism would be using the actions of the state of Israel as a stick with which to beat the Jewish people. A common mistake people make for example is to say "the Jews" have taken Palestinian land. It is not a simple thing to debate safely if you ask me, and if anyone's interested on how to talk about Israel without straying inadvertently into dangerous territory the Actor David Schneider wrote this https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/an ... 05941.html

Dunkirk Spirit wrote: They, the BLMovement have spoken out in support of the Palestinians in their struggle over Israeli occupation of some Palestinian land. Right or Wrong, many people think this is Antisemitism. The occupation of Palestinian land is illegal under international law, so it's legitimate to criticise that Israeli policy. Antisemitism would be using the actions of the state of Israel as a stick with which to beat the Jewish people. A common mistake people make for example is to say "the Jews" have taken Palestinian land. It is not a simple thing to debate safely if you ask me, and if anyone's interested on how to talk about Israel without straying inadvertently into dangerous territory the Actor David Schneider wrote this https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/an ... 05941.html

Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Fri Jul 03, 2020 4:17 pm  

Pumpetypump wrote: The occupation of Palestinian land is illegal under international law, so it's legitimate to criticise that Israeli policy. Antisemitism would be using the actions of the state of Israel as a stick with which to beat the Jewish people. A common mistake people make for example is to say "the Jews" have taken Palestinian land. It is not a simple thing to debate safely if you ask me, and if anyone's interested on how to talk about Israel without straying inadvertently into dangerous territory the Actor David Schneider wrote this https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/an ... 05941.html And yet, the Israeli government have ignored and continue to ignore UN resolutions, year on year. un sanctions against israel The following is a list of United Nations resolutions concerning Israel. As of 2013, Israel had been condemned in 45 resolutions by the United Nations Human Rights Council. Since the creation of the Council in 2006, it has resolved almost more resolutions condemning Israel than on the rest of the world combined. Many of the condemnations are a result of Israel land grab and treatment of Palestinians by the Israel government over many years. I think I’ll leave it at that.

Pumpetypump wrote: The occupation of Palestinian land is illegal under international law, so it's legitimate to criticise that Israeli policy. Antisemitism would be using the actions of the state of Israel as a stick with which to beat the Jewish people. A common mistake people make for example is to say "the Jews" have taken Palestinian land. It is not a simple thing to debate safely if you ask me, and if anyone's interested on how to talk about Israel without straying inadvertently into dangerous territory the Actor David Schneider wrote this https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/an ... 05941.html And yet, the Israeli government have ignored and continue to ignore UN resolutions, year on year. un sanctions against israel The following is a list of United Nations resolutions concerning Israel. As of 2013, Israel had been condemned in 45 resolutions by the United Nations Human Rights Council. Since the creation of the Council in 2006, it has resolved almost more resolutions condemning Israel than on the rest of the world combined. Many of the condemnations are a result of Israel land grab and treatment of Palestinians by the Israel government over many years. I think I’ll leave it at that.

[PopTart]

Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Fri Jul 03, 2020 4:18 pm  

Dunkirk Spirit wrote:

They, the BLMovement/organisation have spoken out in support of the Palestinians in their struggle over Israeli occupation of some Palestinian land. Right or Wrong, many people think this is Antisemitism.

No matter what you think of some of the people in that movement these things in my opinion cannot be contested
1) They don't speak for everyone who supporting the cause that has used the mantra of Black Lives Matter mantra
2) Black Lives actually do matter
3) In 2020 we shouldn't be discussing whether some human beings should matter more than others just because of the colour of their skin.

[PopTart]

Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Fri Jul 03, 2020 4:22 pm  

Pumpetypump wrote: The occupation of Palestinian land is illegal under international law, so it's legitimate to criticise that Israeli policy. Antisemitism would be using the actions of the state of Israel as a stick with which to beat the Jewish people. A common mistake people make for example is to say "the Jews" have taken Palestinian land. It is not a simple thing to debate safely if you ask me, and if anyone's interested on how to talk about Israel without straying inadvertently into dangerous territory the Actor David Schneider wrote this https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/an ... 05941.html I think your point is a pretty easy one to understand. I don't feel responsible for all the land grabs and atrocities of the world caused by Christian countries, so I don't think Jews should be criticised because of the actions of Israel. Saying that, Israel is in a very dangerous position being surrounded by countries that would happily wipe them off the earth, so it isn't easy to understand what they do without being there and living how they have to live.

Pumpetypump wrote: The occupation of Palestinian land is illegal under international law, so it's legitimate to criticise that Israeli policy. Antisemitism would be using the actions of the state of Israel as a stick with which to beat the Jewish people. A common mistake people make for example is to say "the Jews" have taken Palestinian land. It is not a simple thing to debate safely if you ask me, and if anyone's interested on how to talk about Israel without straying inadvertently into dangerous territory the Actor David Schneider wrote this https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/an ... 05941.html I think your point is a pretty easy one to understand. I don't feel responsible for all the land grabs and atrocities of the world caused by Christian countries, so I don't think Jews should be criticised because of the actions of Israel. Saying that, Israel is in a very dangerous position being surrounded by countries that would happily wipe them off the earth, so it isn't easy to understand what they do without being there and living how they have to live.

Re: O/T Politics and Pandemics : Fri Jul 03, 2020 5:10 pm  

PopTart wrote:

I think your point is a pretty easy one to understand.
I don't feel responsible for all the land grabs and atrocities of the world caused by Christian countries, so I don't think Jews should be criticised because of the actions of Israel.

Saying that, Israel is in a very dangerous position being surrounded by countries that would happily wipe them off the earth, so it isn't easy to understand what they do without being there and living how they have to live.

So, are you saying that because the actions of our forefathers centuries ago,(not just the English) that criticism of any country, community, isn’t allowed, and some nations should be allowed to continue doing, because our forefathers did so.