Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 9:50 am  

To be fair it was obvious that the Covid situation has really done us as a club, can’t see what AP could have done about that. He tired to gamble cutting costs on backroom staff for a few years now and that’s hasn’t paid off and the ultimate last throw of the dice was the ‘young and unproven’ recruitment strategy for this season that failed miserably. The numbers don’t add up he’s had to cut back somewhere, he’s ultimately made some terrible decisions though under that pressure.

Still don’t get the anger and hate towards him, but it’s obvious we need a change of ownership now. He’ll always be playing catch up and the atmosphere will just get more and more toxic the further we slide down.

I just don’t see who’s going to buy what’s essentially just a squad of poor players. Get off to decent start to the season, keep steady crowds and maybe we become a more attractive proposition to someone. We really need some clarity on the ‘investment’ situation, we’ve obviously decided to put more money into backroom stuff again from whatever the ‘capital injection’ has been made available to the club but I’m guessing this will need to be paid back at some point.

Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 10:24 am  

DSJ1983 wrote:

To be fair it was obvious that the Covid situation has really done us as a club, can’t see what AP could have done about that. He tired to gamble cutting costs on backroom staff for a few years now and that’s hasn’t paid off and the ultimate last throw of the dice was the ‘young and unproven’ recruitment strategy for this season that failed miserably. The numbers don’t add up he’s had to cut back somewhere, he’s ultimately made some terrible decisions though under that pressure.

Still don’t get the anger and hate towards him, but it’s obvious we need a change of ownership now. He’ll always be playing catch up and the atmosphere will just get more and more toxic the further we slide down.

I just don’t see who’s going to buy what’s essentially just a squad of poor players. Get off to decent start to the season, keep steady crowds and maybe we become a more attractive proposition to someone. We really need some clarity on the ‘investment’ situation, we’ve obviously decided to put more money into backroom stuff again from whatever the ‘capital injection’ has been made available to the club but I’m guessing this will need to be paid back at some point.

I think that the anger, hate and toxicity is largely down to two points that you mention: terrible decisions and sliding down the table. As fans we can only watch these things unfurl and are helpless at preventing them as we're not involved in the actual running of the club. So questions get asked about those that are running the club when things go wrong. And when things continue to go wrong, that's what generates the anger. I'm not saying I agree with it all but I can understand why it's built up as it has.

One other thing that I think has caused the toxicity and stuff is that there seems to be a lack of accountability and transparency from the club, particularly our owner. Today's case in point, AP bemoans the huge medical bills that the club have incurred but won't hold his hand up and admit that a big part of the reason we have such high bills is because he reduced the backroom medical staff in the first place. Instead he's making it sound like it's been bad luck and the improvements to the staff now occurring are forward thinking and savvy moves.

Will be interesting to see what comes out of the fans forum in a few weeks regarding things like the investment, lease agreements, the Covid loan etc but I fear it will largely be all smoke and mirrors.

[Chris71]

Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 11:35 am  

Roam Ranger wrote:

DSJ1983 wrote:

To be fair it was obvious that the Covid situation has really done us as a club, can’t see what AP could have done about that. He tired to gamble cutting costs on backroom staff for a few years now and that’s hasn’t paid off and the ultimate last throw of the dice was the ‘young and unproven’ recruitment strategy for this season that failed miserably. The numbers don’t add up he’s had to cut back somewhere, he’s ultimately made some terrible decisions though under that pressure.

Still don’t get the anger and hate towards him, but it’s obvious we need a change of ownership now. He’ll always be playing catch up and the atmosphere will just get more and more toxic the further we slide down.

I just don’t see who’s going to buy what’s essentially just a squad of poor players. Get off to decent start to the season, keep steady crowds and maybe we become a more attractive proposition to someone. We really need some clarity on the ‘investment’ situation, we’ve obviously decided to put more money into backroom stuff again from whatever the ‘capital injection’ has been made available to the club but I’m guessing this will need to be paid back at some point.

I think that the anger, hate and toxicity is largely down to two points that you mention: terrible decisions and sliding down the table. As fans we can only watch these things unfurl and are helpless at preventing them as we're not involved in the actual running of the club. So questions get asked about those that are running the club when things go wrong. And when things continue to go wrong, that's what generates the anger. I'm not saying I agree with it all but I can understand why it's built up as it has.

One other thing that I think has caused the toxicity and stuff is that there seems to be a lack of accountability and transparency from the club, particularly our owner. Today's case in point, AP bemoans the huge medical bills that the club have incurred but won't hold his hand up and admit that a big part of the reason we have such high bills is because he reduced the backroom medical staff in the first place. Instead he's making it sound like it's been bad luck and the improvements to the staff now occurring are forward thinking and savvy moves.

Will be interesting to see what comes out of the fans forum in a few weeks regarding things like the investment, lease agreements, the Covid loan etc but I fear it will largely be all smoke and mirrors.

I agree with both posts on this matter and as someone running a business myself that went through the Covid situation of having to pay out when having no income I do have a degree of sympathy for AP. Regardless of whether we think his decisions have been good, bad or indifferent pre/post and and during Covid its thanks to him we still have a club at least.

I totally agree with RR in that there is a level of toxicity or bitterness within the fanbase which has been created by AP simply not addressing things and being open about the situation. Instead he gave false promise's as he has been Hull FC owner long enough not to be so naive about the workings of the club and game. I do think he was lead down the garden path by Smith which has also added to the discontentment.

The only way forward if AP is still to be the owner or an integral part of the club is for brutal honesty from AP/The Club about the situation, a genuine apology from AP and no more smoke and mirrors as that just insults the intelligence.

The time for excuses for me stopped when the 2024 season finished.

Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 11:55 am  

The biggest issue for me is the lack of communication. For example he has repeatedly said last years squad was at 'full cap' when logic suggests cuts were made to strengthen finances.

He made it clear the covid loan was a drain in the club, told us when it was due to be paid back, but then hasn't confirmed if it has or not.

I understand that when passes for 2024 went on sale he couldn't say 'sorry guys I'm cutting corners and risk is we will drop down the table' but there's a middle ground between that and telling us the club is still being funded fully and all our issues are bad luck.

Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 12:38 pm  

Irregular Hoops wrote:

Don’t cut support staff budgets, then moan about the direct cost of that.
He’s unfortunately ruining his legacy of 2016 and 2017.
I still haven’t heard any contrition for the last five years, which culminated in whatever last season was.
There’s been a real lack of openness and we’ve all been taken for granted. The shtick has grown old now, and I’m bored of hearing it.
How many other clubs would get the numbers we do to watch the performances we’ve witnessed?

What finished it for me is the completed lack of professionalism this week, with his comments around his failed investment.
To use some of the words he did, when he has daughters himself, was pretty poor to say the least.

Absolutely this.

Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 1:34 pm  

Time for Pearson to move on, say thanks for those two or so years of success, saving us from Kath, getting us through covid years and hopefully getting new investment.

Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 1:56 pm  

UllFC wrote:

The biggest issue for me is the lack of communication. For example he has repeatedly said last years squad was at 'full cap' when logic suggests cuts were made to strengthen finances.

He made it clear the covid loan was a drain in the club, told us when it was due to be paid back, but then hasn't confirmed if it has or not.

I understand that when passes for 2024 went on sale he couldn't say 'sorry guys I'm cutting corners and risk is we will drop down the table' but there's a middle ground between that and telling us the club is still being funded fully and all our issues are bad luck.

That was something I was going to mention as well in my earlier post regarding things creating the toxicity, anger, hate etc and you and Chris71 have mentioned it: false promises. I don't know if we were at full cap or not and to be honest I'm not sure whether I find it more palatable that our owner lied to us or whether it would be better to believe that we so badly misspent the cap.

But whilst something like that is debatable, the bullish promises about being competitive and then serving up what we did just aren't up for debate. That's something he has been guilty of for a number of years. Fair enough, he's got pass sales to think of as you say and even generating enough interest for pay at the gate supporters to attend. But I think to repeatedly make such statements and then failing to deliver has added to the toxicity that is around.

Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 2:27 pm  

Roam Ranger wrote:

But I think to repeatedly make such statements and then failing to deliver has added to the toxicity that is around.

Without a doubt! Public relations are not in good shape at all.

Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 2:44 pm  

Last few years have been s.hite all round from the bottom up. Personally think there will be a few announcements over the coming weeks/ months . It does feel to me like a full restart for the club. Think it will be small steps and I don't think we will be in the top 6 next year. But expect us to be more competitive all round. Maybe get lucky in the CC and get a decent run. It's the hope that kills you

Re: DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings : Tue Oct 22, 2024 2:49 pm  

DSJ1983 wrote:

To be fair it was obvious that the Covid situation has really done us as a club, can’t see what AP could have done about that. He tired to gamble cutting costs on backroom staff for a few years now and that’s hasn’t paid off and the ultimate last throw of the dice was the ‘young and unproven’ recruitment strategy for this season that failed miserably. The numbers don’t add up he’s had to cut back somewhere, he’s ultimately made some terrible decisions though under that pressure.

Still don’t get the anger and hate towards him, but it’s obvious we need a change of ownership now. He’ll always be playing catch up and the atmosphere will just get more and more toxic the further we slide down.

I just don’t see who’s going to buy what’s essentially just a squad of poor players. Get off to decent start to the season, keep steady crowds and maybe we become a more attractive proposition to someone. We really need some clarity on the ‘investment’ situation, we’ve obviously decided to put more money into backroom stuff again from whatever the ‘capital injection’ has been made available to the club but I’m guessing this will need to be paid back at some point.

Its not just a squad of poor average players,its an ageing squad with several injury prone players and even the best backroom conditioning and physios wont be able to prevent them spending too much time sitting in the stands nursing injuries.
Can see this team being competitve for early season matches but not picking up many wins then falling off a cliff.