Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 1:58 pm  

Nice to see all these fans of other rival bids desperate for us to fall short of the £1m turnover figure.

Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 2:03 pm  

a.n Other wrote:

You won the NRC last year and you didn't turnover £1m, Crowds are also down this year. I do hope SOC has tipped more money in to meet the requirements.

Merchandise sales are up as is the club lottery and we have had an extra 3 sponsors come on board.


Crowds are slightly down but that is mainly due to poop performances on the pitch. We still hammer most clubs attendance wise though and have always been well attended in this division.

Were awesome.

Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 2:04 pm  

Chris B wrote:

Nice to see all these fans of other rival bids desperate for us to fall short of the £1m turnover figure.

Not desperate at all. I hope you do meet all that's required and go up. The £1m turnover is the only area you must be concerned about.

Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 2:17 pm  

-VIKINGMAN- wrote:

Were awesome.

I agree.......you were awesome in the late 80's.

Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 2:38 pm  

a.n Other wrote:

Not desperate at all. I hope you do meet all that's required and go up. The £1m turnover is the only area you must be concerned about.

To be honest the £1m turnover is probably one of the easiest points to meet, certainly with SOC in charge.
With his business brain he will have this well covered.

Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 3:32 pm  

My concern for the SL franchise award process is that the RFL are failing to make it fair and transparent once again and in doing so are likely to leave the decision open to legal challenge and ridicule from inside and outside the sport.

The reason for my concerns are nothing to do with the clubs likely to be “promoted” and “relegated”. I personally think Widnes should be awarded a franchise despite not having the best couple of league campaigns. As for who comes down, I neither know nor care.

My concern is that the award process may be considered illegal and that the RFL may be accused of double standards (no, never I hear you cry!). The reasoning being that the RFL has set criteria against which all clubs are to be assessed, then go on to say that a Championship club (Widnes?) will be awarded a franchise and the league will remain at 14 teams. This is in effect a statement that Widnes are not in direct competition with existing SL clubs for a franchise, i.e. Widnes ability to meet SL criteria is not required to be superior to that of the least capable SL club.

Previously clubs applying for a franchise signed a waiver on taking legal action over the decision (happy to be corrected if wrong), with the guarantee that someone is getting the boot, I cannot see SL clubs agreeing to it this time. This may leave the door open to a legal challenge on the grounds that all clubs are tendering an application to the RFL/SLE for the provision of a service (entertainment) and that all tenders have not been treated equally in the selection process.

The decision to stagger the announcement of selection and de-selection will further add to the inevitable fiasco as rumour and “leaks” cause a media circus with the potential for the de-selected club claiming it was unethical of the RFL to allow expenditure on team building/contracts/development when they knew they would be excluded from next years competition etc. That’s the best case scenario, I am concerned they are actually going to stagger the decision making process.

Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 4:00 pm  

Off! Number Seven wrote:

My concern for the SL franchise award process is that the RFL are failing to make it fair and transparent once again and in doing so are likely to leave the decision open to legal challenge and ridicule from inside and outside the sport.

The reason for my concerns are nothing to do with the clubs likely to be “promoted” and “relegated”. I personally think Widnes should be awarded a franchise despite not having the best couple of league campaigns. As for who comes down, I neither know nor care.

My concern is that the award process may be considered illegal and that the RFL may be accused of double standards (no, never I hear you cry!). The reasoning being that the RFL has set criteria against which all clubs are to be assessed, then go on to say that a Championship club (Widnes?) will be awarded a franchise and the league will remain at 14 teams. This is in effect a statement that Widnes are not in direct competition with existing SL clubs for a franchise, i.e. Widnes ability to meet SL criteria is not required to be superior to that of the least capable SL club.

Previously clubs applying for a franchise signed a waiver on taking legal action over the decision (happy to be corrected if wrong), with the guarantee that someone is getting the boot, I cannot see SL clubs agreeing to it this time. This may leave the door open to a legal challenge on the grounds that all clubs are tendering an application to the RFL/SLE for the provision of a service (entertainment) and that all tenders have not been treated equally in the selection process.

The decision to stagger the announcement of selection and de-selection will further add to the inevitable fiasco as rumour and “leaks” cause a media circus with the potential for the de-selected club claiming it was unethical of the RFL to allow expenditure on team building/contracts/development when they knew they would be excluded from next years competition etc. That’s the best case scenario, I am concerned they are actually going to stagger the decision making process.

I don't see it being any different to the last time around. All clubs bar one will need to submit applications for 13 spots.. if you don't you're not in.. if you do then you will have to waive your right to legal dispute.

As for the leaks.. they will happen.. but quite often they are not leaks at all. Simply people guessing and spouting their opinions. In terms of staggering the decision making process. I think it is an excellent decision. The newly promoted club needs to play catch up and this time is priceless. I often thought that when promotion and relegation were about that the Champ season should end well before the SL season so that the promoted team had an opportunity to prepare and ready themselves.

Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 4:08 pm  

a.n Other wrote:

Not desperate at all. I hope you do meet all that's required and go up. The £1m turnover is the only area you must be concerned about.

Not really in 2009 we got a average of 3800 plus and some where freebies.This year no freebies and average over 3061 and a Northern Rail final. Merchandise and runners up prize money from this day out and we have 3 extra sponsors.Last year missed out by £100,000 and if can make the playoffs it be extra revenue.If all fails i am sure £250,000 wont kill Stobarts.As vikingman says the Lottery is generating money and viqi.

Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 4:23 pm  

Thing is Chris you cannot enforce a waiver on a point of law, for example companies cannot refuse to employ you unless you sign a waiver stating you agree not to sue them for any transgression on their behalf.

Business law in the UK is extremely clear an the requirement for fairness in all tender/selection processes. If a lawyer can find precedent or believes it can be set in this case the RFL could be in trouble.

I would have thought that your club as the most likely i.e. dead certs to receive a franchise would be the most keen to see a transparent decision making process. How tiring do you think it will get if this board is flooded with disgruntled fans of the relegated club stating how you never had to compete with their criteria performance.

The staggered decision/announcement is a disaster waiting to happen. I cannot understand why the "promoted" club needs longer under the franchise system than under regular P&R, the "relegated" club and its players are not given that grace to put their affairs in order. All I can see it doing is encouraging cost cutting next season when you get the nod. If it is a staggered decision it demonstrates the unfair nature of the process and makes a mockery of the RFL and the sport.

Re: The future of Widnes Vikings : Thu Aug 05, 2010 4:39 pm  

Having a million pound turnover in a season is relatively easy for any club , any decent accountant could ' filter ' money through an account to achieve it

That is providing you were aware of this requirement in sufficient time to do it

I would guess that some [ a ] clubs knew about this , and some [ the rest ] clubs didn't

Similarily , the 2,500 average crowd ' criteria ' only seems to have reared it's ugly head a couple of months ago

It would seem to me that your poor on field performance might have unnerved certain people in power resulting in a little fine tuning , not that this bothers me as it just means that only you will not be wasting money actually submitting an application

This is not a ' pop ' at your good selves or your proud club

As usual we [ the rest ] have been treated as idiots

Good isn't it

All the best