: Mon Aug 24, 2009 3:40 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Did anyone see the Superleague Show on Sunday (It was on Sky 101 so will have been national on the Beeb and Sky)? The RFL communications bloke was interviewed, as was Celtic Chief Exec and one of the players soon to be back in Australia (felt sorry for him, I did).

It seems that 13 other clubs used the very same visas used by Celtic for the Aussie six during the same period. The RFL has requested sight of the UKBA report to see why Celtic have been targeted, given the widespread perfectly legitimate use of those particular visas at that time.

ie.....who grassed up the Crusaders?
Can we have a poll??????

: Mon Aug 24, 2009 4:20 pm  

gutterfax, i would hardly consider being docked 2 points for breaking a threadbare wage cap being anywhere near in the same league as an offence as employing illegal immigrants is.

Plus, our offence, while breaking super league rules, did not break the law of our green and pleasant land!

please stop referring to me as a 'troll', its cringeworthy. Id rather be called a d******d or w*****r or something

: Mon Aug 24, 2009 4:32 pm  

halifaxxx wrote:

gutterfax, i would hardly consider being docked 2 points for breaking a threadbare wage cap being anywhere near in the same league as an offence as employing illegal immigrants is.

Plus, our offence, while breaking super league rules, did not break the law of our green and pleasant land!

please stop referring to me as a 'troll', its cringeworthy. Id rather be called a d******d or w*****r or something

you are neither intelligent or smart enough to be called anything else. I know plenty of WanI(ers, but you are just a wind up merchant troll.
You start threads or respond to them with the sole intention of getting a response.....and here is the case in point.
You were docked points for CHEATING.......simple really. If you hadn't CHEATED, you would have been relegated with the worst record and the worst attendance average but as it is, you were relegated with the worst record and worst attendance record anyway. As for threadbare, I am referring to the Salary Cap of Superleague, which you were in for 8 years and managed to do nothing in apart from break the cap.....maybe you thought it would make you more like Wigan if you broke it.
As for UK employment law....the Crusaders may well get fined, but as for the RFL.....they have already made it clear that visas aren't their problem, so no points deduction. They haven't played unregistered players.....they haven't broken any RFL regulations....they have simply fallen foul of UK border controlls that allow a hook handed "preacher" of terrorit rhetoric stay in the UK AND HAVE HIS FAMILY TO RESIDE AT OUR EXPENSE whilst kicking out 6 hard working guys earning a living.......
Insane...in my humble opinion

: Mon Aug 24, 2009 4:34 pm  

gutterfax wrote:

you are neither intelligent or smart enough to be called anything else. I know plenty of WanI(ers, but you are just a wind up merchant troll.
You start threads or respond to them with the sole intention of getting a response.....and here is the case in point.
You were docked points for CHEATING.......simple really. If you hadn't CHEATED, you would have been relegated with the worst record and the worst attendance average but as it is, you were relegated with the worst record and worst attendance record anyway. As for threadbare, I am referring to the Salary Cap of Superleague, which you were in for 8 years and managed to do nothing in apart from break the cap.....maybe you thought it would make you more like Wigan if you broke it.
As for UK employment law....the Crusaders may well get fined, but as for the RFL.....they have already made it clear that visas aren't their problem, so no points deduction. They haven't played unregistered players.....they haven't broken any RFL regulations....they have simply fallen foul of UK border controlls that allow a hook handed "preacher" of terrorit rhetoric stay in the UK AND HAVE HIS FAMILY TO RESIDE AT OUR EXPENSE whilst kicking out 6 hard working guys earning a living.......
Insane...in my humble opinion

good economics degree at newcastle university would suggest otherwise

: Mon Aug 24, 2009 5:24 pm  

I see a number of clubs look to be in the same trouble as the Celts, and apparently nothing to do with cheating. Pity, it is the Celtic who were first to be in this trouble.Could all those who have been so quick to pick on the club go somewhere else please.

: Mon Aug 24, 2009 6:33 pm  

halifaxxx wrote:

gutterfax, i would hardly consider being docked 2 points for breaking a threadbare wage cap being anywhere near in the same league as an offence as employing illegal immigrants is.

Celtic didn't employ illegal immigrants. At the time they were doing just what 13 other clubs were doing: employing players under the working holidaymaker visa with the modification brought about by one club which had successfully challenged earlier limitations imposed by UKBA (or whatever it was back then). That 13 other clubs are not presently under investigation is because all the Aussies employed by them have already returned home, bar one player, according to the RL press today.

So you can blather on about the Crusaders all you like. Had Fax been employing one of its Aussies under the same visa and had that Aussie still been playing for Fax, he too would have been on a plane home.

: Mon Aug 24, 2009 6:46 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

Celtic didn't employ illegal immigrants. At the time they were doing just what 13 other clubs were doing: employing players under the working holidaymaker visa with the modification brought about by one club which had successfully challenged earlier limitations imposed by UKBA (or whatever it was back then). That 13 other clubs are not presently under investigation is because all the Aussies employed by them have already returned home, bar one player, according to the RL press today.

So you can blather on about the Crusaders all you like. Had Fax been employing one of its Aussies under the same visa and had that Aussie still been playing for Fax, he too would have been on a plane home.

2 points

The 13 other clubs had used the ' loophole ' before 2005 and still had players contracted past that date [ a bit like the W1g4n argument when they brought the salary cap in ]

All 6 Celtic players got their visa's after that date , a point Craig Spence from the RFL states that " from that point the RFL adopted a policy of agreeing to register some player with these visa's [ amateur only ] but not encouraging it

So it's nothing to do with ' just because they have returned home ' at all

HTH

: Mon Aug 24, 2009 6:57 pm  

Starbug wrote:

2 points

The 13 other clubs had used the ' loophole ' before 2005 and still had players contracted past that date [ a bit like the W1g4n argument when they brought the salary cap in ]

All 6 Celtic players got their visa's after that date , a point Craig Spence from the RFL states that " from that point the RFL adopted a policy of agreeing to register some player with these visa's [ amateur only ] but not encouraging it

So it's nothing to do with ' just because they have returned home ' at all

HTH

I don't think you have listened and/or read about this in its entirety, my little stalker.

One club challenged the ruling around 2004 and won dispensation from the UKBA (or whatever it was called back then). It was on the basis of that ruling that the 13 clubs referred to are relevant as they recruited under the working holidaymaker visa as it stood post 2004 and up to 2008 when the rules changed again. Those recruits from those 13 clubs have subsequently returned home, bar one player other than the six at the Crusaders.

: Mon Aug 24, 2009 7:11 pm  

SaintsFan wrote:

I don't think you have listened and/or read about this in its entirety, my little stalker.

One club challenged the ruling around 2004 and won dispensation from the UKBA (or whatever it was called back then). It was on the basis of that ruling that the 13 clubs referred to are relevant as they recruited under the working holidaymaker visa as it stood post 2004 and up to 2008 when the rules changed again. Those recruits from those 13 clubs have subsequently returned home, bar one player other than the six at the Crusaders.

No they did not , those players were already in this country before that time , the UKBA allowed them to complete their agreed contracts with the clubs [ if not they could potentially have sued the clubs ]

As I said and surely as a Saints fan you will remember the W1g4n argument when the salary cap was introduced that they had to pay cotrcated players past that date or they could be sued for beaking those contracts

Gateshead won dispensation for amatuer players only

Are you saying that these 6 players including one with 150 NRL appearances and recent SOO matches played over here for nothing for 2 seasons ?

: Mon Aug 24, 2009 7:32 pm  

Starbug wrote:

Are you saying that these 6 players including one with 150 NRL appearances and recent SOO matches played over here for nothing for 2 seasons ?

Nooo. I didn't say anything of the kind. The players' histories was irrelevant, my little stalker.