Re: Afghanistan: Does this undo all the work done? : Mon Mar 19, 2012 10:39 pm
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rumpelstiltskin wrote: I could speculate that perhaps he had some sort of epiphany, which was reinforced by his subsequent viewing of his favourite movie, which then provided the impetus for his one man campaign. The only two people who really know are Davis and his Pastor I *could* say you're attempting to muddy the waters by spinning an irrelevant point into an implied character weakness. Oh, I did. If that middle ranking Officer could be shown to have an extensive combat background, backed up with a good military record throughout his career, then I would tend to agree with you. Isn't four combat tours enough? However, I'm still not fully convinced about Davis. One item in particular shows his lack of front line experience. He complains about the Taliban kidnapping and killing an Afghan Police Officer, 500 yards away from their compound, and witters on about the American influence not even extending as far as you can see. Any soldier that has been in combat over there knows that the insurgents are very good at setting their ambushes, and live IEDS have been found placed within 10 yards of Patrol Bases. And this proves we're in control in what way? Here's a more ROBUST REBUTTAL A robust rebuttal written by the former special assistant to Paul Wolfowitz, speechwriter for the Joint Chiefs of Staff and one of the architects of the Iraq war? You're really bringing out the big guns insofar as objective analysis is concerned.  BTW, how many combat tours has Collins served in Afghanistan? Indeed, has Collins served a combat tour anywhere? From my - albeit brief - research he appears to be a retired career staff officer. As I recall Mugwump, you were provided with the facts which showed your claims, re Afghan civilian casualties, were simply a product of your own fertile imagination! Your subsequent sidestep to attempt to include Iraq was duly noted. You provided a small subset of what *all* organisations estimate to be a huge number of civilian deaths. If you dispute this you can't be taken seriously. And as one of the reasons for the invasion of Iraq was a phoney link to the same group we are engaged against in Afghanistan it is entirely relevant. I refuse to believe that you have never watched a documentary,or read an informed newspaper column detailing the ongoing improvements in Afghanistan over the last few years. I've just supplied an informed and detailed report - written by a four combat term veteran with complete access. I can supply others, too. The only evidence you have supplied so far is a critique written by Paul Wolfowitz's Washington stooge and mouthpiece. He may even be the same Joseph Collins linked to Aegis LLC and Tim Spicer, who the Americans describe as “an individual with a history of supporting excessive use of force against a civilian population [who] vigorously defends [human rights abuses]”. Classy. [/i] Or are we playing a game where my evidence is speculation whereas anything you provide is "informed"? If you can hold on for another 3 weeks, our Nick can give you an up to date resume, complete with photographs. I could link you to various MOD blogs/videos, MOD blogs?  And "our Nick" is employed in what role, precisely? Does he have the same level of experience and access as Davis? Or does he work for Aegis knocking over democratically elected governments for corporate gain? but I suspect they're not your cup of tea. Or point you in the direction of official UN stats that show the staggering number of refugees, encouraged by the improving situation, returning from Pakistan back to their homeland. Point me in any direction you like. I could,.....but as penance for your left wing rhetoric, I think you should do your own googling. Something along the lines of "Improvements in Afghanistan since 2001" should suffice. And I'll get, erm ... improvements? Are the contrary suddenly not important? If we could judge both quantitatively and it were found the former outweighed the latter would it suddenly not matter? |
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rumpelstiltskin wrote: I could speculate that perhaps he had some sort of epiphany, which was reinforced by his subsequent viewing of his favourite movie, which then provided the impetus for his one man campaign. The only two people who really know are Davis and his Pastor I *could* say you're attempting to muddy the waters by spinning an irrelevant point into an implied character weakness. Oh, I did. If that middle ranking Officer could be shown to have an extensive combat background, backed up with a good military record throughout his career, then I would tend to agree with you. Isn't four combat tours enough? However, I'm still not fully convinced about Davis. One item in particular shows his lack of front line experience. He complains about the Taliban kidnapping and killing an Afghan Police Officer, 500 yards away from their compound, and witters on about the American influence not even extending as far as you can see. Any soldier that has been in combat over there knows that the insurgents are very good at setting their ambushes, and live IEDS have been found placed within 10 yards of Patrol Bases. And this proves we're in control in what way? Here's a more ROBUST REBUTTAL A robust rebuttal written by the former special assistant to Paul Wolfowitz, speechwriter for the Joint Chiefs of Staff and one of the architects of the Iraq war? You're really bringing out the big guns insofar as objective analysis is concerned. BTW, how many combat tours has Collins served in Afghanistan? Indeed, has Collins served a combat tour anywhere? From my - albeit brief - research he appears to be a retired career staff officer. As I recall Mugwump, you were provided with the facts which showed your claims, re Afghan civilian casualties, were simply a product of your own fertile imagination! Your subsequent sidestep to attempt to include Iraq was duly noted. You provided a small subset of what *all* organisations estimate to be a huge number of civilian deaths. If you dispute this you can't be taken seriously. And as one of the reasons for the invasion of Iraq was a phoney link to the same group we are engaged against in Afghanistan it is entirely relevant. I refuse to believe that you have never watched a documentary,or read an informed newspaper column detailing the ongoing improvements in Afghanistan over the last few years. I've just supplied an informed and detailed report - written by a four combat term veteran with complete access. I can supply others, too. The only evidence you have supplied so far is a critique written by Paul Wolfowitz's Washington stooge and mouthpiece. He may even be the same Joseph Collins linked to Aegis LLC and Tim Spicer, who the Americans describe as “an individual with a history of supporting excessive use of force against a civilian population [who] vigorously defends [human rights abuses]”. Classy. [/i] Or are we playing a game where my evidence is speculation whereas anything you provide is "informed"? If you can hold on for another 3 weeks, our Nick can give you an up to date resume, complete with photographs. I could link you to various MOD blogs/videos, MOD blogs? And "our Nick" is employed in what role, precisely? Does he have the same level of experience and access as Davis? Or does he work for Aegis knocking over democratically elected governments for corporate gain? but I suspect they're not your cup of tea. Or point you in the direction of official UN stats that show the staggering number of refugees, encouraged by the improving situation, returning from Pakistan back to their homeland. Point me in any direction you like. I could,.....but as penance for your left wing rhetoric, I think you should do your own googling. Something along the lines of "Improvements in Afghanistan since 2001" should suffice. And I'll get, erm ... improvements? Are the contrary suddenly not important? If we could judge both quantitatively and it were found the former outweighed the latter would it suddenly not matter? |
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