Yes they do.

No they don't.

Yes they do.

Without wanting to intrude on your yes/no lovers tiff, would you care to explain why you think they already pay enough tax??....

Kind of agree that they do already pay enough. Just cos they are in a profession that earns them a large salary, why should they have to pay more tax compared to your average joe who works in the local super market?? Just cos they earn more can't be anyone's argument that they have to pay more, surely?



What would your argument be that they should have to pay more? Why should an MP/judge/solicitor etc, earning £100k+ a year have to pay twice or three times more tax than your average joe on till at Asda earning £12k a year?? Do they not all work a similar amount of hours? Does the work involved necessitate them paying more?...

So who do you suggest we squeeze for the extra money?



We could raise the tax burden of the poor? - Oh sorry we've already done that by increasing VAT



Or maybe we could simply take the UK's trotal annual expenditure and then divide it by the working population and everyone then pays the same amount. The only problem with that is many will be working simply to pay tax



What is the problem with expecting those who earn more to pay more?



Last Thursday Peter Stringfellow argued that if HIS conservative party had the balls to abolish the 50p rate, he would possibly open more clubs. I can't think of a more compelling argument to keep or increase the top rate

Well I would have thought the answer is obvious. It's because they can and because the numbers would not stack up if they did not. If someone earns £12,000 at Asda even if they paid 100% income tax that would not pay for their share of the NHS, education, the armed forces, the police, care for their elderly parents, etc, etc. You either have a State and a welfare state or you don't. If you do then someone needs to pay for it. That has to be middle to high earners. It isn't going to be the poorest or the mega-rich. The former can't, the latter have no need to - they could relocate to somewhere warmer and nicer and pay for their own care.



Interesting observation from Titan on his move from supermarket shelf-stacking to professional life. He thinks it's odd that people in better paid jobs get extras as a matter of course - profitable expense claims, regular parties with free drink and food whereas in his lower paid supermarket job there were no extras and they had to pay for the Christmas party. Funny old world isn't it?

Quote airliebird9="airliebird9"Without wanting to intrude on your yes/no lovers tiff, would you care to explain why you think they already pay enough tax??....'" Nice article here news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8417205.stm

Quote airliebird9="airliebird9"Without wanting to intrude on your yes/no lovers tiff, would you care to explain why you think they already pay enough tax??....'" Nice article here news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8417205.stm

Quote Richie="Richie"Nice article here news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8417205.stm'" Statistics hey, you can make them read what ever way you want them to...

Quote Richie="Richie"Nice article here news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8417205.stm'" Statistics hey, you can make them read what ever way you want them to...

Quote Richie="Richie"Nice article here news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8417205.stm'" An even better one [url=http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2011/10/27/most-millionaires-support-warren-buffetts-tax-on-the-rich/HERE[/url

Quote Richie="Richie"Nice article here news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8417205.stm'" An even better one [url=http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2011/10/27/most-millionaires-support-warren-buffetts-tax-on-the-rich/HERE[/url

If they're going to start tightening the law and investigating tax avoidance I'd like them to start with Premiership Footballers who avoid the majority of UK tax, then work downwards, they won't get to 98% of the population anytime soon.

Really? I'd like them to start with Tesco, Vodafone etc, and work down from there. That'll just be my 'politics of envy' at work again, what?

We must start linking tax payments to passports, protection by the State and ability to reside here. That way if the rich media / sportstars / entrepreneurs wish to go offshore when tax rates are high they should lose their right to resettle here. Going offshore when realising capital gains should also be considered "anti-British" and intolerable.



Ditto company's threatening to relocate their HQs overseas when they earn decent revenues here (eg Prudential). In the US they would get slated. Here we are soft.

Tesco/Vodafone and the likes employ thousands of people, Wayne Rooney puts a ball in a net a couple of times a week.

What is it about employing thousands of people that uniquely qualifies you to avoid paying your taxes and then have a special deal thrown at your feet years later rather than a summons?



Do larger employers that did pay their taxes now qualify for a rebate?



Why do you accuse others of envy when anything that involves a famous person means you either don't care about their civil liberties and human rights or are looking for ways to treat them differently than ordinary people under the law?

What else can you make them read and why would you want to?

It's not unique. We can all avoid tax, even those of us on PAYE.

"Special deals" is just a tax office being pragmatic.

I'm sure you can point me to other cases of companies avoiding six billion in tax and then having by far the greater majority of it written off, what with it not being unique and everything.

Ah, ok, so when you said



"What is it about employing thousands of people that uniquely qualifies you to avoid paying your taxes and then have a special deal thrown at your feet years later rather than a summons?"



What you actually meant was a far more specific:

"What is it about employing thousands of people that uniquely qualifies you to avoid paying specifically $6b in tax and then have a special deal offered that writes the greater majority off, rather than a summons?"



In which case, that was quite unique, unlike general avoidance of tax.

I think given the context it would take an expert in avoiding the charitable interpretation to have avoided understanding what I meant. But then this is the sin bin, so such things are to be expected.

If Wayne Rooney did avoid paying some or all of his income tax, he would still be dodging a minuscule fraction of the amount the likes of Tesco and Vodafone dodge. They should [iall[/i pay what's due, but enforcement should start with those whose avoidance makes the most difference.



Oh, and, what vbfg said.

Does Rooney "dodge" tax? You make a bold, potentially libellous comment!

It wasn't my statement, actually. Standee made the assertion that Premiership footballers routinely dodge tax and used Wayne Rooney as an example. I just chose not to contest that point. I accept though, that for clarity my post should have began:



"If Rooney does in fact avoid tax..."



I'll edit it now.

Not really, not when you're asking why a unique situation with a unique company and a unique outcome, was not unique.

In the interests of balance, I am aware of one former CEO of a high street retail chain who put his entire £20m settlement package on his "retirement" through PAYE, thereby paying tax and Class 1 NIC on the lot - and have seen the payslip that went with it.



Being super-rich doesn't necessarily mean you're indulging in tax avoidance/mitigation/evasion.