First of all I think what the Brigante's do is great. The atmosphere that comes with it is great and all the flags and everything are superb and look really good on matchdays. And i am sure that the whole idea of the Brigante's is to do exactly that. I don't know many of the people involved very well personally but went to the fund raiser thing a few months ago and it's plain to see that its all bout creating a better match day experience for fans and getting chants going and all the rest of it.



Although i do think the fact that you are effectively segregating yourself's from other fans will open you up to some of the criticisms you are getting...(again yes , i know you are always welcoming anyone to join you etc etc but im just pointing out why people may feel the opposite).



Even if isn't your intention people are right to see things that way. Ultimately you are Wigan fans, so having your own logo and a tribal name such as Brigante's, again is going to make certain people think otherwise. This isn't my opinion btw, I'm just trying to see it from another angle. Again, the whole scarf thing is clear to me a way of helping you get funds for flags, but people are bound to see that as a similarity to certain Ultra groups, even if they understand wrongly.





Whatever that lad did, the Brigante's shouldn't be held responsible for that. He is a Wigan fan, we are all wigan fans.... and what he did would reflect badly on us all. and rightly so he seems to have been punished for it. There where plenty of drunken stupid idiots acting like clowns at matches before the Brigante's came along, and there will be plenty of drunken idiots around now, regardless of the great stuff that the Brigante's are doing. and it's good to see that you are being very proactive to show everyone that things like what happened last night are not what you are about. Anyway, Keep up the good work!

there are a lot of young 18 and under idiots who have attached themselves to the Brigantes and they now seem to outnumber the original Brigante members. My view of the Brigante's has now changed from it being a good idea for atmosphere to it being like a class chav outing for the kids and i dont see how the original Brigante members can stop these people joining in at away games. If these idiots are willing to vandelise their own stadium then what will they do to Saints new ground or other away grounds.



The worry is these idiots who would of still been idiots are now damaging a brand in the Brigante name and also the name of Wigan Rugby and that is not acceptable

there are people who have had alot more involvement in the flags ect, but iv been there since the first meetings. for me thats how it should have stayed, have collections for new flags, the odd fundraiser ect, as soon as this "ultra s^ite came in and banners with skulls were getting made up it was asking for trouble.

No.





Is it true that you was one of the "Wigan fans" hurling abuse at anyone with a flag at Hull KR, then attempting to steal one?

This is the problem with giving yourself a daft moniker and logos with skulls on and using the word "ultra".



You don't need any of the above to collect for flags and sing songs. There was talk of a similar "ultras" group on the Saints forums that got shot down and there have been loads of new flags funded and made anyway. The general consensus was that it would be divisive, with a "normal fans" and "ultras" segregation that is unhelpful and unnecessary.



As for wearing scarves over faces, good grief. Where's that "roll eyes" smiley.



You're all Wigan fans under one banner - all this ultra, brigantes, S2 etc is a bit cringeworthy and is always likely to attract unsavoury behaviour.

Whittle wanted me to steal the flag! promised me he could get it signed an then he would return it. Can i ask why dont you sing any of the older songs now? i felt quite lonely singing them on my own...cheers for that ultras.

Well the flags had been paid for by someone using there own hard earned money, and your the one calling The Brigantes and having a pop? Talk about being a hypocrite!



Also, there shouldn't be any kind of split with fans and that was NEVER the intention at all, im sure people would join in with "older songs" if you stood with them and everyone tried to get along, this conversation is ridiculous, we are all Wigan Fans, the Brigantes was an idea to make the support more colourful, vibrant, loud and vocal, not for people to have to be a "member" its just a myth and its not true.



Also the above posters that have said things like "putting scarves over faces" I have never seen anyone with a scarf over a face its another "RL fans Brigantes myth", nor have I seen anyone involved in the group being violent or causing any trouble what so ever.

The problem is with these groups is that there is a fine line between what is the wrong and what is right. Personally I think the Brigantes concept is brilliant. I love seeing colour at games and I love what the likes of Conroy have been doing with the flags. Moments like Old Trafford where the big WE ARE WIGAN banner was unveiled proves what you can achieve and I have supported the Brigantes by attending the fundraiser held in November.



However as many people have already stated you get some of the young 14 and 15 year old chavs who see this as an oppertunity to vandalise. These people are not rugby fans and the stigma of groups such as the Brigantes then suggests Hooliganism which is not what the group is all about. You get 14 and 15 year old kids bringing the reputation of the group down which will look poor on the club.



The question is what do we do about it? There will become an uneasy divide and fans will begin to question the brigantes if people continue to vandalise their own ground, as well as away grounds with stickers plastered everywhere. The stickers should be scrapped as should the whole S2 gimmick, it should be The Brigantes.



Keep up the colour, keep up the noise, but scrap all the nonsense with stickers being stuck everywhere because it's moving the Brigantes from being a welcoming group who want as many people as possible to join in to something which many fans will not want to associate with!



By the way this is not a pop at the regular members. You follow the club home and away like myself and these people are giving you lot a bad name which is wrong.

Im not a fan of the ultras gimmick because of the stigma it receives, but its all uneducated hoo ha.

In English supporting terms, an ultra is a fan who supports their club in extroidanary ways. Ie, with flags and constant singing. The word is from latin origin meaning to beyond the norm. The Brigantes go beyond the norm to support the club, hence the term. The Brigantes is simply a name with which we can be known by and can market.



The Wigan fans have always been criticised for a poor atmosphere and then when a good one arrives, fellow fans want to be little it and see it crumble. Thats frustrating il admit, but each to their own.

The S2 gimmick was used because that is the block the group is situated in and was used to attract people that wanted to get involved into that particular block. The word Hooliganism is way over the top, since this whole thing began there has never been any violence what so ever at any game.



The divide at the moment is simply there because fellow Wigan fans have been quite judgemental and tarred people with the same brush, ONE absoulute scrote has taken a spray can to the game, somebody that has no connection to the group and all of a sudden the Brigantes are "alienating" people and all the people that are sat waiting to have a pop at the Brigantes come crawling out of the woodwork. I notice there wasn't a thread congratulating the Brigantes on the large sum of money donated to charity? Or any flag displays the group has put on.



The split/divide thing is ridiculous, we had some fantastic away days ast year were hundreds of Wigan fans got inolved and everyone njoyed themselves, why should it be different this season?

I think the whole idea of the flags/banners & creating a better matchday experience is fantastic & i applaud anyone who has genuinely put their time & effort into doing so

. Although it does seem that overtime as the Brigantes have grown the original idea has been somewhat ised by some members who seem more obsessed with trying to cultivate the image of football hooliganism, which will only lead to more dick'eads wanting to get involved & unfortunately when they do stupid things it will reflect badly on the group & club whether they are affiliated with the Brigantes or not.

Absoulute rubbish!!! Who are these "some members", enlighten me.



Expand on the football hooliganism bit please? There has been no violence what so ever since the group formed or any threat of violence at any game. Another MYTH.

This

Im sure at Hull KR there was a lad wearing a cherry and white balaclava and yes I know its probably just a joke but it does appear to outsiders as something intimidating and gives the image of hooliganism

X2.

I'm in no way saying the Brigantes are a bunch of violent thugs going around causing trouble or threatening people but the whole 'Ultras' image to most people is football hooliganism so unfortunately that's the way the Brigantes will be seen by many outsiders.

Then it's to =#FF0000us all to "educate" them into what the group is really about.

Then let outsiders think that, Wigan fans know that the Brigantes are not a violent group so what is the problem?

Exactly! The Brigantes have been great with all the work that they've done. The only issue is how they are perceived by other Wigan fans. They are supposed to be inclusive since they aren't trying to set themselves above any other Wigan fan.

However if someone questions whether the ultras term or the flag designs might give the wrong impression to other Wigan fans the reaction is generally to shoot them down or mock them.



If the idea is to create a good atmosphere at Wigan games and get as many people joining is as possible then they would take the concerns seriously and make an effort to distance themselves from 'ultras' and the negative connotations that come with it; at least to begin with, so that people can see what they are really doing rather than being put off.

Sort of, but there was also a thread telling people not to sit near you if they didn't want to sing constantly and jump up and down in favour of actually watching the game.



If a "Don't sit near us" message is not dividing the supporters, then what is?



Sorry, I can't buy into the whole 'Brigantes' thing. We're all Wigan supporters at the end of the day and I'm not being told how I should support them. By all means, sing, dance, wave scarves, provide flags and all the rest of it - it looks fabulous. But I can't help feeling that MORE people would buy in if you didn't put yourselves on some kind pedestal as an 'ultrafan', somehow better than the rest of us, and give yourselves a label.



But maybe that's just me.

I hate agreeing with Fear The Vee, but this is spot on, in my opinion. Wigan fans are Wigan fans.

Just want to say that i have nothing whatsoever to do with the group in question, but i think some others on here may have been awaiting the chance to have a pop at them.



Ok, so one person has used an aerosol as far as we know, and? The police are unable to "Police" many things, what do you expect rugby fans to do if other peoples kids are badly brought up!



My feelings were that when people were mentioning that they would be in a certain area to encourage good natured singing and chanting, it was being done as a common curtesy to other people, and not to create an "us and them" situation as has been suggested. But if you are so paranoid as to think that, maybe you need phyciatric (SP) help with that. You could say that the Skull was a little "misjudged", but other than that i think its a shame that people feel this is worthy of getting all hot and bothered about.



Get a life for goodness sake!!!



BTW, i am an old fart....

Robinson, its not a 'don't sit with us' in that way. It's more 'this is what is being done in this area, if you're not up for it, you may want to sit somewhere else'. If you catch my drift. That's also the idea of 1 location, so people know where its happening.



Unfortunately, on a written forum some people have issues expressing themselves in writing, and some have issues with how they read things. Misunderstandings are common place on internet media.

so has it affected people who already sat in said area/s who didnt want to join in? have they been 'forced' to move?