Re: Pope Francis the First : Thu Mar 14, 2013 5:18 pm  

Dally wrote: So, are you confirming that in your opinion that people are not "born" homosexual? Or at least they are destined to be single-generational (within their family's context) abberations? If people are neither born nor choose to be homosexual how does homosexuality come about? Serious question. I don't think he was, but he can speak for himself. However as the world's leading scientific brains haven't found the answer to that yet, I am thinking your question that El Barbudo should explain it is a tad demanding. It might be more fruitful for you to google 'epigenetics'. A whole libraryful of work has been done on the subject across the globe, and here's just one interesting study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3030621/

Dally wrote: So, are you confirming that in your opinion that people are not "born" homosexual? Or at least they are destined to be single-generational (within their family's context) abberations? If people are neither born nor choose to be homosexual how does homosexuality come about? Serious question. I don't think he was, but he can speak for himself. However as the world's leading scientific brains haven't found the answer to that yet, I am thinking your question that El Barbudo should explain it is a tad demanding. It might be more fruitful for you to google 'epigenetics'. A whole libraryful of work has been done on the subject across the globe, and here's just one interesting study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3030621/

Re: Pope Francis the First : Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:15 pm  

Dally wrote:

So, are you confirming that in your opinion that people are not "born" homosexual?...

No, of course I am not confirming that, I was simply (light-heartedly) puzzling over how such a gene could be passed on.
Whether someone is born homosexual is neither proof nor refutation of whether a genetic predisposition to homosexuality exists.

However (and I'm guessing here), I'd reckon that a recessive gene could maybe do it, only showing up a characteristic in an individual where two genes have a matching allele.
That's how certain genetic characteristics can skip a generation or several before showing up again.

Dally wrote:

... Or at least they are destined to be single-generational (within their family's context) abberations? If people are neither born nor choose to be homosexual how does homosexuality come about? Serious question.

You seem to under the illusion that characteristics determined by genes will show up in every generation.
This is not the case.

If it is ever proven that there is a "homosexual gene", I get the feeling that you'll be recommending gene therapy for gays rather than accepting that is natural.

Re: Pope Francis the First : Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:05 pm  

El Barbudo wrote:

No, of course I am not confirming that, I was simply (light-heartedly) puzzling over how such a gene could be passed on.
Whether someone is born homosexual is neither proof nor refutation of whether a genetic predisposition to homosexuality exists.

However (and I'm guessing here), I'd reckon that a recessive gene could maybe do it, only showing up a characteristic in an individual where two genes have a matching allele.
That's how certain genetic characteristics can skip a generation or several before showing up again.

You seem to under the illusion that characteristics determined by genes will show up in every generation.
This is not the case.

If it is ever proven that there is a "homosexual gene", I get the feeling that you'll be recommending gene therapy for gays rather than accepting that is natural.

Could there perhaps be a multiplicity of "causes"?

Re: Pope Francis the First : Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:58 pm  

El Barbudo wrote:

Pedants' corner.
1. Homosexual genes is a bit of a puzzler, how do they get passed on to another generation?
2. Being as how he's the Pontiff, isn't it now Francis's job to pontificate?

Don't mind me, I'll go away soon.

How do you explain the significant % of gay men that have very feminine traits - high voices, very slim bodies effeminate mannerisms is that all learned/copied?

Re: Pope Francis the First : Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:12 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

How do you explain the significant % of gay men that have very feminine traits - high voices, very slim bodies effeminate mannerisms is that all learned/copied?

.....I know, its like when these 'celebs' like Will Young, Nick Grimshaw, that chap from Steps and there have been many more, decide to 'come out' and the general reaction of most people is '...and he hadn't come out already?' type of thing.

I can't believe these feminine traits are learned or copied - I recall going to school with a lad who was extremely camp, even at junior school age, and it came as no shock years later when he 'revealed' he was gay....Most of us used to tell him that at school in a typical kids-at-school sort of way....

Re: Pope Francis the First : Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:24 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

How do you explain the significant % of gay men that have very feminine traits - high voices, very slim bodies effeminate mannerisms is that all learned/copied?

Probably the same way that some women are quite 'masculine'.

Re: Pope Francis the First : Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:52 am  

Dally wrote:

Could there perhaps be a multiplicity of "causes"?

You still don't seem to have grasped the differences between gender, sex and sexuality yet

Re: Pope Francis the First : Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:52 am  

Sal Paradise wrote:

How do you explain the significant % of gay men that have very feminine traits - high voices, very slim bodies effeminate mannerisms is that all learned/copied?

Nor do you

Re: Pope Francis the First : Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:26 am  

So, getting back to the topic, is the Pope gay?

Re: Pope Francis the First : Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:04 am  

Ferocious Aardvark wrote:

So, getting back to the topic, is the Pope gay?

I'll send him an email.